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Discussion Boards => Off-Topic => Debate & Discuss => Topic started by: carty1 on February 10, 2012, 08:37:56 pm
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The President is doing the best job he can many people don't agree but he's great as a President. He has helped many people :thumbsup: :wave:
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You're going to get a lot of flak for this especially since you didn't post any reasons why he's doing good. He has done a lot of good (New trade agreements, getting Bin Laden during his term, ending the war in Iraq, more border patrol, repealed 'dont ask dont tell', more money into schools + slightly longer school days for kids, an attempt at a decent healthcare reform etc. etc.), he's also done a lot of bad (...the healthcare reform, TSA bs, national debt climbing at a higher rate, etc.).
My opinion- he's okay. I'm still not a big fan of him. Then again, people need to understand that presidential popularity declines heavily as the years go by.
(http://philosophistry.com/scans/2009/01/presidential-cycles.gif)
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How come every time a politician or the government 'helps' it ends up costing me more money and I end up losing more freedoms?
Nice graph Falconer02, it is revealing.
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A good president would change the social contract to a Economic one not a military one. Right now, we are spending close to a trillion dollars on the military even though we have nukes... We really only need like 100 nukes not over 100,000. If we switch to a ecnomic contract, we can actually save the world. America has so much farmland, we can use the land to feed all the people in the world. By doing this, the rich will become richer and everyone is happy. But stupid idiots are in the government now.
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A good president would change the social contract to a Economic one not a military one. Right now, we are spending close to a trillion dollars on the military even though we have nukes... We really only need like 100 nukes not over 100,000. If we switch to a ecnomic contract, we can actually save the world. America has so much farmland, we can use the land to feed all the people in the world. By doing this, the rich will become richer and everyone is happy. But stupid idiots are in the government now.
As noble as that sounds, the Government has no responsibility or authority to "feed the world" (although we technically do already). The job of our government is basically as follows "keep us Free", "keep us Safe", manage roads and such, make it easy for states to trade with each other and for business to do business across state lines (lol they reversed it to make it harder because they changed they don't understand that 'regulate' meant "make regular" back in the day...one reason I hate to see words get redefined), and a few other lesser things after that. Our government has no authority to so social security or medicare or medicaid or student loans or any of this other crap it has squandered our blood on. Such things only end up harming us and enslaving the citizens and they are as vile an evil as any can imagine when you take them to their ends and realize their effects.
So a bad and criminal president would do what you suggested, and I hope you can understand why that is.
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I love our President. He has taken care of Sudam Hussan, and Osama Bin Ladin. He help the UN get rid of Kadaffi. He has also cleared out quite a few AlQuida. The cost of the military is not on him that was Bush (wars started by Bush), he is slowly taking us out of the war areas without causing the Countries to much stress at the transition of taking over their own battle. When Bush took office the first thing he did was DOUBLED his salary. When President Obama took office he cut his salary as well as all of his personel. He bailed out the Car industry in Detroit and every one of them bounced back within the first year. He wants people like me unemployed and my husband because of his race who has been overlooked for benefits for over a year now to be able to see a doctor when needed by having insurance that we couldnt get any other way. He is helping us. You only have to look at what he has said and done to know that the American population is his main focus.
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I love our President. He has taken care of Sudam Hussan, and Osama Bin Ladin. He help the UN get rid of Kadaffi. He has also cleared out quite a few AlQuida. The cost of the military is not on him that was Bush (wars started by Bush), he is slowly taking us out of the war areas without causing the Countries to much stress at the transition of taking over their own battle. When Bush took office the first thing he did was DOUBLED his salary. When President Obama took office he cut his salary as well as all of his personel. He bailed out the Car industry in Detroit and every one of them bounced back within the first year. He wants people like me unemployed and my husband because of his race who has been overlooked for benefits for over a year now to be able to see a doctor when needed by having insurance that we couldnt get any other way. He is helping us. You only have to look at what he has said and done to know that the American population is his main focus.
The military took care of Hussein and Bin Laden. Hussein under Bush and Bin Laden under Obama. Gaddafi was killed by rebels. Presidents cannot declare war, only congress can. Between Bush and Obama, only Obama engaged in costly military action without the authorization of Congress. Obama followed the guidelines set under Bush regarding withdrawal from Iraq. Bush did not double his salary, since a president doesn't control his own pay. Congress doubled the presidential salary under Clinton. Obama did not cut his salary in half (again since that is not controlled by the president), and it remains at the same level as under Bush. Chrysler is now owned by Fiat and is no longer an American controlled company. Taxpayer total loses in the bailouts to the auto industry total over 23 billion. I would hardly celebrate any 'bounce back' over losing 23 billion and one American car company. I do agree with you that Obama wants people unemployed. I am glad that he helped your husband. Personally he hasn't helped me and I don't have insurance (although I can see a doctor whenever I want to, just like I and everyone else was always able to do). I do believe he is focused on the American population as well, much like a cat focuses on a canary.
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id rather have a president can keep his words to stay true then just play some wishful thinkin.. he said the troops will be back at christmas there is no promise to that.. but i do appreciate his work ethic and hes way better then bush tho.. but all in all i think political stuff is just crap.. so many lies and conspiracy going on..
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Obama helped my daughter when we were able to put her back on our insurance... I will always have good thoughts towards him because of this... I just wish we could keep her on it longer...
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I highly doubt any President elected in this age wanted/wants to be President "to help" (unless it's to help themselves).
To me, most of the choices for Presidency are a matter of looking for what I consider the "lesser evils". I don't care much for most of them.
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Look at the mans history..where he grew up , who were his mentors, associates, so called czars. His hisory with mentors, and associates suggest that not only is he a Muslim...(Nothing wrong with that, but lying about it? What else does he lie about?) but that his political leanings are toward socialism ( hence the "healthcare reform"..the first step..socialized medicine) Look at how in the past he refused to wear the American flag pin, that most lawmakers wear. Look at how in the past, when the Pledge of Allegience was being said or the Natonal Anthem was played.....there he was in a crowd of people with their hand on their heart or saluting, standing there doing his famous "crotch salute". The one reason he stopped is because he couldn't take the public flack anymore. That's about as phony as one can be. I could go on and on!
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I'm pretty liberal. I will vote democrat 75% of the time at least.
I am VERY unhappy with Obama's first term.
I feel he has made small gains in terms of policies he ran on. He was "crippled" by a republican Congress for the last two years of his d "yes We Can"term. Whatever.
The progress he made as far as the economy is beginning to show (lowered unemployment rate, Dow Jones highest since 2007) but if I wanted realistic, moderate change.... I WOULD HAVE VOTED FOR HILLARY CLINTON in 2008!!!
I wasn't promised "A 2% reduction in unemployment over 39 months"... I was promised "CHANGE" and "Yes We Can"
We aren't any worse off right now because of him. No one in office the last three years would have had us in a Utopia. But Obama has grossly fell short of what he promised. He promised us *bleep*, but gave us blue jelly beans.
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The President is only here to help his masters, not the people. The merging of Corparations/State (Fascism) is becoming deeper every day. When both the R's and D's agree on something then that means it's bad for the people and great for the corporations.
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:wave: obama did not end the war in iraq. the troops left on the time line already negociated before he took office. all obama has done is run the largest deficit in the history of our country. he has divided our country more than any president in history. he should not even hold the office of dog catcher.
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:wave: obama did not end the war in iraq. the troops left on the time line already negociated before he took office.
That's fairly accurate.
all obama has done is run the largest deficit in the history of our country.
That's fairly inaccurate. Congress controls deficit spending and this was run-up under other, (republican), presidents to its current levels.
he has divided our country more than any president in history.
In what particular ways?
he should not even hold the office of dog catcher.
Many dog catchers should not hold that office, let alone that of president, (based upon their capabilities within the parameters of either office).
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He promised us *bleep*, but gave us blue jelly beans.
lol Nice line. Made me giggle. :)
I'm not too peeved at Obama - I came to terms that change has to be gradual a while ago. Even if it's a tiny step, at least it's forward and not backwards. Start the ball rolling, and it might be easier in the future to nudge it to the side and onto a better path later, you know? Uhm, I'm not very good at metaphors, lol.
Plus, some of the current crop of candidates are saying things I very much disagree with and find stupid, so I'm finding myself going "at least Obama doesn't say crazy stuff like this" and thinking more favorably about him lol.
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:wave: obama did not end the war in iraq. the troops left on the time line already negociated before he took office.
That's fairly accurate.
all obama has done is run the largest deficit in the history of our country.
That's fairly inaccurate. Congress controls deficit spending and this was run-up under other, (republican), presidents to its current levels.
he has divided our country more than any president in history.
In what particular ways?
he should not even hold the office of dog catcher.
Many dog catchers should not hold that office, let alone that of president, (based upon their capabilities within the parameters of either office).
I just can't believe there are still people in the United States of America that still support Obama! He has done nothing to help the majority of the people and has run us so far in debt we will probably never get out. And, did you see the clip yesterday where he was meeting with someone from Russia and was low-talking and did not know his mike was still live and he was telling this guy to just wait until he gets re-elected and things will be much better. He patted the guy on the knee and the guy told him he will pass the message along to Valdimir (I believe thats who he said). We are the laughing stock of the entire world because he's always apoligizing for America and now he wants to buddy up to the Russians!! What is wrong with this picture?!? And, what is wrong with the people who run around with their eyes closed to what is really going on in the world and here on our domestic soil? Its unbelieveable! Another 4 years of Obama and we will be a Socialist nation with nothing but memories of what our great Country used to be. Please people, come to your senses before its too late
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I couldnt agree more with the topic!!!
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I love our President. He has taken care of Sudam Hussan, and Osama Bin Ladin. He help the UN get rid of Kadaffi. He has also cleared out quite a few AlQuida. The cost of the military is not on him that was Bush (wars started by Bush), he is slowly taking us out of the war areas without causing the Countries to much stress at the transition of taking over their own battle. When Bush took office the first thing he did was DOUBLED his salary. When President Obama took office he cut his salary as well as all of his personel. He bailed out the Car industry in Detroit and every one of them bounced back within the first year. He wants people like me unemployed and my husband because of his race who has been overlooked for benefits for over a year now to be able to see a doctor when needed by having insurance that we couldnt get any other way. He is helping us. You only have to look at what he has said and done to know that the American population is his main focus.
The military took care of Hussein and Bin Laden. Hussein under Bush and Bin Laden under Obama. Gaddafi was killed by rebels. Presidents cannot declare war, only congress can. Between Bush and Obama, only Obama engaged in costly military action without the authorization of Congress. Obama followed the guidelines set under Bush regarding withdrawal from Iraq. Bush did not double his salary, since a president doesn't control his own pay. Congress doubled the presidential salary under Clinton. Obama did not cut his salary in half (again since that is not controlled by the president), and it remains at the same level as under Bush. Chrysler is now owned by Fiat and is no longer an American controlled company. Taxpayer total loses in the bailouts to the auto industry total over 23 billion. I would hardly celebrate any 'bounce back' over losing 23 billion and one American car company. I do agree with you that Obama wants people unemployed. I am glad that he helped your husband. Personally he hasn't helped me and I don't have insurance (although I can see a doctor whenever I want to, just like I and everyone else was always able to do). I do believe he is focused on the American population as well, much like a cat focuses on a canary.
Correct and to the point as usual, sir. Amazing how ignorant the average Joe is.
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all obama has done is run the largest deficit in the history of our country.
That's fairly inaccurate. Congress controls deficit spending and this was run-up under other, (republican), presidents to its current levels.
I just can't believe there are still people in the United States of America that still support Obama! He has done nothing to help the majority of the people and has run us so far in debt we will probably never get out.
That's fairly inaccurate. Congress controls deficit spending and this was run-up under other, (republican), presidents to its current levels.
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The President is only here to help him self mostly at are expense !!!!!
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The President is only here to help him self mostly at are expense !!!!!
I actually wish that were true, but it's not, it's much worse. He is here to destroy our free country, and replace it with a socialist, communist dictatorship. He has no respect for our rights guaranteed by the Constitution, which becomes evident when he lets things slip that weren't supposed to come out.
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I agree with falcon9 on his responses. You can't blame Obama for everything just because you are a Republican. If you look at the chart just prior to Bush2 taking office, it was Clinton that held up the best in ratings during his Presidency. Yes, he made plenty of mistakes, but remember the republicans spent 8 years chasing him instead of doing their job in the congress and house. Even through all the crap the threw at him, he still managed to balance the budget before leaving office and the question at that time was where to put the extra money. Well, we won't see that question again in my lifetime after the way Bush changed our balanced system.
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I think we have made major improvements in this country from the end of Bush to now. Yes we are still at war, have high unemployment and healthcare is an issue. Bit look at the whole picture in front of our president and how he had dealt with it. We are getting closer to a better controlled war, the unemployment level is getting better month by month and the healthcare issue is a beast that would be extremely hard for any person to handle at all. Have a good one everyone!!!
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I agree with falcon9 on his responses. You can't blame Obama for everything just because you are a Republican. If you look at the chart just prior to Bush2 taking office, it was Clinton that held up the best in ratings during his Presidency. Yes, he made plenty of mistakes, but remember the republicans spent 8 years chasing him instead of doing their job in the congress and house. Even through all the crap the threw at him, he still managed to balance the budget before leaving office and the question at that time was where to put the extra money. Well, we won't see that question again in my lifetime after the way Bush changed our balanced system.
Gingrich and Kasich balanced the budget with very little help from Clinton. Until then Clinton ran large budget deficits. It was part of the Gingrich revolution. Unfortunately the revolution petered out and the Republicans turned back into big spending politicians.
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the one thing i didnt like about obama he didnt kept his promise on releasing the troops in afganistan last year during xmas like he said he would... but i like his other abilties on what he did that bush caused in the first place. obama cleared bushes mess by a landslide... but now alot of angry folks saying alot of crap aboout obama mishaps. hey get it to your head peeps bush planned this and willing to make obama has heat...
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the one thing i didnt like about obama he didnt kept his promise on releasing the troops in afganistan last year during xmas like he said he would... but i like his other abilties on what he did that bush caused in the first place. obama cleared bushes mess by a landslide... but now alot of angry folks saying alot of crap aboout obama mishaps. hey get it to your head peeps bush planned this and willing to make obama has heat...
I agree with some of that. Obama was handed 2 wars and a very unpopular bailout that was actually thrown at him in the very last days before election. A smart politician would have seen what was coming. Obama never backed off, and has tried to accomplish many things he wanted to get done, despite the dire circumstances he was thrust in. Republicans spend their time chasing birth certificates, tying him to muslim heritage, and other image bashing over the four years, just like they did when Clinton was in office. Obama has to incorporate public influence to even get the republicans to work with congress and the house, since they try to stop anything he promoted that would help the country. I'm not a party guy, I vote for the individual, not the party in the end. After seeing how the Republican side spends all their time in character assassination and delaying the duties of the government, I'm sick of that group. I used to always feel it's the corporate control of government that prevents America from moving forward for our workers and families. Now I'm about to put the Republicans right up there with corporate controlled government. Oh I forgot. They are from oil and insurance and banking industries in their campaigns. I guess that ties them together like an iceberg sinking any chance for Americans to move forward, just like the Titanic.
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Considering we have the highest corporate tax rate in the world, I would really question this idea that we have a corporate ran government.
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Abrupt, I don't know all the incentives and tax givebacks involved, but I do know that my most recent job in HR, we got a tax credit for over $3500 for every employee we hired. The company hired over 12,000 employees the 7 years I was there. In some cases, based on military or disability issues, that credit jumped to 7 to 8 thousand in credits to hire the individual. We just forwarded the 8850 to the corporate hr office and the money was a given.
Unfortunately most never made it through training, and those that did usually never made it 6 months due to the stress levels in the customer service center. We still got the credit for hiring them. We averaged between 800 to 1000 employees at our location, which was only one of many. The company averaged over 50,000 employees and it was primarily customer service representatives.
In the time I was there that averaged 1714 people each year being hired. If I just go with the 3500, that would be around 5,999,000 earned each year hiring people with the government incentives in place. Since we only had around 800 to 1000 employees on site at my location, and we had at least 100 employees and managers that had been there long term , this means we basically recycled 90 % of our employees each year. That's almost 6 million in tax incentives just for our site alone.
Like I said before, I don't know about all the other corporate incentives companies get... but as you can see they can be very lucrative to the companies, so much so that the company reinvents their policies to take advantage of them.
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One of my pet peeves is you cannot spend and borrow your way out of debt. I did not vote for Obama,but i did expect him to hold up to his promises. Our social security is not a federal benifit but what we have worked and paid into all of our working years. Those that are drawing welfare did not. I resent being clumped in with them. And if Clinton and Johnson had not used ss money we would not be in the spot that we are now. Pay it back. And obama healthcare sucks. Why doesn't congress have to live with the same insurance that we do. Pay into ss. and not get a life payment for their short or long terms ( crooks).
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Abrupt, I don't know all the incentives and tax givebacks involved, but I do know that my most recent job in HR, we got a tax credit for over $3500 for every employee we hired. The company hired over 12,000 employees the 7 years I was there. In some cases, based on military or disability issues, that credit jumped to 7 to 8 thousand in credits to hire the individual. We just forwarded the 8850 to the corporate hr office and the money was a given.
Unfortunately most never made it through training, and those that did usually never made it 6 months due to the stress levels in the customer service center. We still got the credit for hiring them. We averaged between 800 to 1000 employees at our location, which was only one of many. The company averaged over 50,000 employees and it was primarily customer service representatives.
In the time I was there that averaged 1714 people each year being hired. If I just go with the 3500, that would be around 5,999,000 earned each year hiring people with the government incentives in place. Since we only had around 800 to 1000 employees on site at my location, and we had at least 100 employees and managers that had been there long term , this means we basically recycled 90 % of our employees each year. That's almost 6 million in tax incentives just for our site alone.
Like I said before, I don't know about all the other corporate incentives companies get... but as you can see they can be very lucrative to the companies, so much so that the company reinvents their policies to take advantage of them.
But who is to blame here? Remember, the money that a company makes is theirs, not the governments. The government steals its portion for protection money. Regardless of the principles of taxation, it is still theft. In the case you point out, the government is basically saying "we will steal less of your money if you comply with these conditions". I find it difficult to become angry at someone just because they are not being robbed as much as I am.
Cronyism is not limited to the Republican Party and so it is unfair to single them out. Look at GE and its tax rates under Obama for reciprocated favors? Look at the ban on conventional bulbs to move to these new environmentally hazardous bulbs that are touted as 'environmentally friendly' and track who benefits from such a thing. Targeted tax favors are certainly unseemly, but it isn't like they are actually getting sent checks by the government...no wait they are now with Obama and his green energy allies. Depending on what political affiliation one holds to the other sides actions will always seem more obvious and sinister and we will develop our own justifications for those of our side.
This is something I warn about regarding regulation and a large government. The larger the government and the more regulations the more such things will occur and they are forever entwined. If the government shackles a corporation to its wrist as it would a convict, then the government must also travel where this 'convict' goes. Go back to a smaller government and less regulations (of course need some regulations but not this plethora we currently have) and such things disappear proportionately. I don't know what it is about people that they so love to develop complex mechanization where the simple suffice -- perhaps it is the part of us that leads to inventiveness, but in government it is foolish.
I say they government should simplify and steal less from us and steal from all of us at the same percentages (well maybe two different rates but not so many as we have with all the irregular deductions and exemptions and exceptions). If we all know that everything is fair among us we can more readily agree upon whether to raise taxes or lower them -- after all if raising taxes on you doesn't raise them on my why wouldn't I agree to such a thing (and vice versa)?
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"This is something I warn about regarding regulation and a large government. The larger the government and the more regulations the more such things will occur and they are forever entwined. If the government shackles a corporation to its wrist as it would a convict, then the government must also travel where this 'convict' goes. Go back to a smaller government and less regulations (of course need some regulations but not this plethora we currently have) and such things disappear proportionately. I don't know what it is about people that they so love to develop complex mechanization where the simple suffice -- perhaps it is the part of us that leads to inventiveness, but in government it is foolish.
I say they government should simplify and steal less from us and steal from all of us at the same percentages (well maybe two different rates but not so many as we have with all the irregular deductions and exemptions and exceptions). If we all know that everything is fair among us we can more readily agree upon whether to raise taxes or lower them -- after all if raising taxes on you doesn't raise them on my why wouldn't I agree to such a thing (and vice versa)? "
I agree with what you posted quoted above. I just wish our government bodies, house and congress, would stop wasting time attacking each other all the time and start working together to get things accomplished.
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If the prez is for the people why can't they say they're the president of america or the united states of america. Is it possible U.S. is a company and america is the people?