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Discussion Boards => Off-Topic => Debate & Discuss => Topic started by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 11:04:25 am

Title: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 11:04:25 am
Every once in a while, (okay, a lot more often than that), the opportunity to re-examine these questions tend to present themselves to me in a variety of situations; is it actually detrimental to "dumb it down" for others or, wouldn't that be condescending and ultimately not beneficial for everyone?   Does "talking over someone's head" inherently 'insult' them or, motivate them to figure out what in the blue blazes they're going on about?

Since it isn't my intention to unintentionally 'sway' opinions regarding these questions, I'll answer them from my perspective after anyone who wishes to responds with theirs.

As to the 'locked thread' which sparked this new one, (placed in d+d for a few different reasons); I accept the apology of the OP who 'paged' me and I want to both thank her for inspiring this thread while offering my apology for any unintended emotional duress caused by my posts.

For all of my apparent "fans", 'anti-fans', 'secret admirers', (ya'll outed yourselfs and we're on to you now *chuckle*), 'anti-groupies', honored opponents and newly-minted FC friends and acquaintances; I did read every one of your comments just as the thread was locked.  Thank you, guys, (and gals inclusively).  The perspectives offered by each of you had me pondering however, I'm not sure answering them all in a separate thread wouldn't constitute 'reopening' a thread which Kohler locked.  

   So, in a rare moment of potential indiscretion, (at least a few will probably grin at that), this thread was begun to discuss & debate the question(s) of 'dumbing-down or wising up'.  Like the forum "sign" says about d+d; "enter at your risk", (to which I'll add, don't worry - my bite is much worse than barking in a forum).


*crickets chirping*
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Falconer02 on May 02, 2012, 11:59:23 am
I think the answer is far too broad and only applies to each individual member of the forum. You will have a handful of people that are actually willing to learn given evidences, you have the people that are not willing to learn and just speak their mind regardless of evidences (an overabundance of these in religious topics), and then you have the idiots who can't spell, toss ad homs left and right, and/or 'crap all over the chessboard' constantly.

If someone's going to complain about "all them smart words" an arguer tosses around, I don't see why they just can't quote the words and ask "what do you mean by this"? If they get offended by someone 'talking over their head', they're probably better off not getting involved. Unfortunately this mature concept is rarely practiced.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 12:08:11 pm
Just wanted to say that I'm REALLY glad you started this......and now that I am out of steam from blabbing away in "The Locked Topic" (is that a new mystery novel??), I need 3 cups of Espresso to get revved up again. AND some other people's posts to respond to also.

Since it isn't my intention to unintentionally 'sway' opinions regarding these questions.....
Well of course it isn't, you big silly! If you sway other's opinions, who the heck will you have to debate? ;D

As to the 'locked thread'.......I accept the apology of the OP who 'paged' me.......while offering my apology for any unintended emotional duress caused by my posts.
VERRRY nice! Spoken like a gentleman!
Funny how (I think) we all tend to be the same in this area....."one side" makes an apology, which in turn makes the "other side" feel kind of bad too, and then of course....
we just GOTTA apologize too!
I'm aware I'm making an assumption on this that includes you, falcon9......but I bet it fits you too, you BIG MEANY!! (JK....as I'm sure you know)

For all of my apparent "fans", 'anti-fans', 'secret admirers', (ya'll outed yourselfs and we're on to you now *chuckle*), 'anti-groupies',.....
GEE! Can I PLEASE be ALL of those?? PLEASE,  PLEASE,  PLEASE?

So, in a rare moment of potential indiscretion....

;D   :thumbsup:   :o   Alrighty then....

.....(don't worry - my bite is much worse than barking in a forum)
Either way, you are getting no biscuits.  Bad dog.

*crickets STILL chirping*

*Just one QUICK off-topic question for you, falcon9: Any chuckles at the "Burning you at the stake" cartoons???

OK I PROMISE not to post ANY MORE stupid humor here from this point forward. (You KNOW how hard that's going to be for me......being the wise cracking "class clown" at heart that I am  (read SMART-A**/WISE-A**)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sigmapi1501 on May 02, 2012, 12:13:36 pm
If you're gonna call someone a dummy, the least you can do is put it in words they understand.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 12:15:04 pm
If you're gonna call someone a dummy, the least you can do is put it in words they understand.

Wouldn't that defeat the purpose, (depending upon what the purpose was)?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: SherylsShado on May 02, 2012, 12:21:33 pm
Dumbing-down or wising-up?

My thought(s) would be "pot luck"...    

This is a forum.  No one in here is perfect.  No one in here knows EVERYTHING.  Every single person in this forum knows at least one thing that someone else does not, everyone "brings something different to the table".      

Everyone is free to contribute and share, and may discover new friendships but insults, criticisms, name-calling, "calling-outs", etc.  are probably going to result in "food-fights".

(http://dl2.glitter-graphics.net/pub/1325/1325012c6523fh4az.gif) (http://www.glitter-graphics.com)

@duroz---your post above, nicely done! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 12:37:35 pm
Just wanted to say that I'm REALLY glad you started this......and now that I am out of steam from blabbing away in "The Locked Topic" (is that a new mystery novel??), I need 3 cups of Espresso to get revved up again. AND some other people's posts to respond to also.

You might thank "cateyes" for starting this, although that did inspire me to start this thread topic.

Since it isn't my intention to unintentionally 'sway' opinions regarding these questions.....

Well of course it isn't, you big silly! If you sway other's opinions, who the heck will you have to debate? ;D

Interestingly, stated that sometimes engenders the opposite effect, (not that anyone is 'swayed' but, some often become even more determined not to be swayed ... that's probably just human nature, for some humans).


As to the 'locked thread'.......I accept the apology of the OP who 'paged' me.......while offering my apology for any unintended emotional duress caused by my posts.

VERRRY nice! Spoken like a gentleman!
Funny how (I think) we all tend to be the same in this area....."one side" makes an apology, which in turn makes the "other side" feel kind of bad too, and then of course....
we just GOTTA apologize too!
I'm aware I'm making an assumption on this that includes you, falcon9......but I bet it fits you too, you BIG MEANY!! (JK....as I'm sure you know)

In this particular instance, I didn't offer an apology because the OP did it first. As I said, I read this morning's comments to the locked thread referred to and considered my actual intentions, (rather any that may have been imputed to my posts there).  After a ponder, (roughly 3.33 nanoseconds  :P ), it was concluded that some people may be constitutionally-unsuited to the logic of debate and are likely to be unaware of what doctor's, (for instance), are taught about being "emotionally-detached" lest it influence what they are trying to accomplish.  The same concept applies generally to debate, (and other situations), in that debate is essentially the exchange of opposing viewpoints done in either a logical, illogical, (emotional), or mixture of both manner.  Since it isn't possible to know in advance which of these a proponent of an opposing viewpoint may be coming from, (sans prior experience with a particular opponent), one usually ends up finding out after the raft is down-river and in the rapids.

For all of my apparent "fans", 'anti-fans', 'secret admirers', (ya'll outed yourselfs and we're on to you now *chuckle*), 'anti-groupies',.....

GEE! Can I PLEASE be ALL of those?? PLEASE,  PLEASE,  PLEASE?

Wouldn't 'fan' and 'anti-fan' be mutually contradictive if you chose both?

So, in a rare moment of potential indiscretion....


;D   :thumbsup:   :o   Alrighty then....

You're not tacitly implying that those aren't so rare or momentary, are you?  *chuckle*

Either way, you are getting no biscuits.  Bad dog.

*crickets STILL chirping*

No more crickets since at least four others have chimed-in on this thread. Actually, that was added because no replies were expected until later in the day/evening.  Apparently, I was in error about that. <-- save that quote, you anti-fans!  :bootyshake:

*Just one QUICK off-topic question for you, falcon9: Any chuckles at the "Burning you at the stake" cartoons???

OK I PROMISE not to post ANY MORE stupid humor here from this point forward. (You KNOW how hard that's going to be for me......being the wise cracking "class clown" at heart that I am  (read SMART-A**/WISE-A**)

Not only did I see your cartoon attachments on you post, I laughed and shamelessly swiped 'em for my own personal gain, (well, maybe not gain but, to "annoy" other people elsewhere with).  If that's not cool, I'll consider trying to determine how to give them back.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 12:47:53 pm
Dumbing-down or wising-up?

My thought(s) would be "pot luck"...

So, can that be inferred as similar to what "Falconer02" posted about this?  

This is a forum.  No one in here is perfect.  No one in here knows EVERYTHING.  Every single person in this forum knows at least one thing that someone else does not, everyone "brings something different to the table".

True however, those weren't the questions posed.  For instance, even the youngest child, usually lacking any formal education, can suddenly offer a very penetrating insight - that's not in question. *  

Everyone is free to contribute and share, and may discover new friendships but insults, criticisms, name-calling, "calling-outs", etc.  are probably going to result in "food-fights".

Let the food fly then, people are going to express their viewpoints in all manner of appropriate and inappropriate ways, (unless censored).  That aspect actually directly applies to the subject of this thread; can "dumbing-down" comments for another be considered as self-censoring and implicitly 'insulting' as subtlely encouraging another to "wise-up"?  Or not?

* - Hey, Sheryls; didn't you just tell me that these d+d's were not the light converation you were currently pursuing?  This isn't meant to disparage your posting to this thread, (I was happily surprised but it, however).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 12:56:28 pm
I think the answer is far too broad and only applies to each individual member of the forum. You will have a handful of people that are actually willing to learn given evidences, you have the people that are not willing to learn and just speak their mind regardless of evidences (an overabundance of these in religious topics), and then you have the idiots who can't spell, toss ad homs left and right, and/or 'crap all over the chessboard' constantly.

Your observation is essentially an accurate one, my friend.  Although I enjoyed your 'parody' post in that auspiciously-locked thread, I should mention that both you and the OP of that thread inspired me to start this topic.  Thanks.  Now, can it be deduced from your observations in this regard that some things ought to be "dumbed-down" for some individuals and not for others?  Further, is the subtle process of 'talking over some people's heads' too subtle an encouragement to "wise-up" some some but, not for others?

If someone's going to complain about "all them smart words" an arguer tosses around, I don't see why they just can't quote the words and ask "what do you mean by this"? If they get offended by someone 'talking over their head', they're probably better off not getting involved. Unfortunately this mature concept is rarely practiced.

I can speculate in regards to that phenomenon in that it's not uncommon.  That is, usually most people want to avoid 'appearing to be stupid', (whether to others or, as a self-admission).  Given that general predisposition of an 'ego defensive mechanism', it may be more difficult for someone wwho isn't entirely 'stupid' to admit than someone who is 'too stupid to even know that they're too stupid' for instance, (no reference to any particular individually is specifically implied by this remark).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 01:08:59 pm
This is a forum.  No one in here is perfect.  No one in here knows EVERYTHING.  Every single person in this forum knows at least one thing that someone else does not, everyone "brings something different to the table".    

You are exactly correct on this, SherylsShado, and even if the one thing someone knows is NOT a thing many/any others WANT to know/know about......that person STILL has that knowledge.

@duroz---your post above, nicely done! :thumbsup:

awww shucks.....thank you! :D
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 01:20:47 pm
GEE! Can I PLEASE be ALL of those?? PLEASE,  PLEASE,  PLEASE?

Wouldn't 'fan' and 'anti-fan' be mutually contradictive if you chose both?

Well YEAH!! That way I could just be wishy-washy, not commit myself to feeling like one or the other.... ::) ;D

You're not tacitly implying that those aren't so rare or momentary, are you?  *chuckle*
Ummmmm......er...... :confused1: do I have to answer ALL the questions on the quiz today??

Not only did I see your cartoon attachments on you post, I laughed and shamelessly swiped 'em for my own personal gain, (well, maybe not gain but, to "annoy" other people elsewhere with).  If that's not cool, I'll consider trying to determine how to give them back. 
Well as long as you swiped them shamelessly! But DEFINITELY please DO use them to annoy others with. And you needn't CONSIDER trying to determine how to give them back.....(I notice that you only said you would CONSIDER it)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 02, 2012, 01:25:48 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:29:04 pm
GEE! Can I PLEASE be ALL of those?? PLEASE,  PLEASE,  PLEASE?

Wouldn't 'fan' and 'anti-fan' be mutually contradictive if you chose both?


Well YEAH!! That way I could just be wishy-washy, not commit myself to feeling like one or the other.... ::) ;D

Since I didn't want to assume that you are female before, are you inadvertantly confirming it now?  :P

You're not tacitly implying that those aren't so rare or momentary, are you?  *chuckle*

Ummmmm......er...... :confused1: do I have to answer ALL the questions on the quiz today??

Your choice, as always.

Not only did I see your cartoon attachments on you post, I laughed and shamelessly swiped 'em for my own personal gain, (well, maybe not gain but, to "annoy" other people elsewhere with).  If that's not cool, I'll consider trying to determine how to give them back.  

Well as long as you swiped them shamelessly! But DEFINITELY please DO use them to annoy others with. And you needn't CONSIDER trying to determine how to give them back.....(I notice that you only said you would CONSIDER it)

Thanks. :thumbsup: That word was used because the process of trying to give back something c&p'd online presented somewhat of a conceptual challenge in that I'm pretty sure it can't be done.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 01:30:24 pm
....someone who is 'too stupid to even know that they're too stupid'

I MUST be borrowing this now.....I LOVE IT!!!!
(I think I've met a person or two who fits into this category :sad1:)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:30:35 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 02, 2012, 01:34:08 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?
Actually your entire intro to this topic had me literally laughing out loud!
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:34:48 pm
....someone who is 'too stupid to even know that they're too stupid'

I MUST be borrowing this now.....I LOVE IT!!!!
(I think I've met a person or two who fits into this category :sad1:)

We probably all have however, there's going to be some who will assume that this observation does not apply to them - just to everyone else, (like assuming that the freeway traffic jam is everyone else's fault but yours?).  Having said that, there must be evidence to support the contention that a person is 'too stupid to even know that they're too stupid', otherwise the risk of someone just tossing that out as an empty insult will make the tosser 'too stupid to even know that they're too stupid'.  :-X
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:38:22 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?

Actually your entire intro to this topic had me literally laughing out loud!

Ah, well that's good then. :)  I'd thought you were referring to some of the humorous bits posted by others that I might have missed while posting replies to others.

So, as to the subject of this thread, have you any of your in-depth insights in that regard?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 01:41:11 pm
Wouldn't 'fan' and 'anti-fan' be mutually contradictive if you chose both?

Well YEAH!! That way I could just be wishy-washy, not commit myself to feeling like one or the other.... ::) ;D

Since I didn't want to assume you are female before, are you inadvertantly confirming it now?  :P  

Really?  :o  You said that??

 ;D  :thumbsup:

Did I say THIS already?  BAD DOG!!!

*crickets chirping* *FLIES BUZZING*......around big piles of  :bs:
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 02, 2012, 01:49:31 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?

Actually your entire intro to this topic had me literally laughing out loud!



Ah, well that's good then. :)  I'd thought you were referring to some of the humorous bits posted by others that I might have missed while posting replies to others.

So, as to the subject of this thread, have you any of your in-depth insights in that regard?


Since I am married to a man that is as skillful with language as you yourself is I have been forced to learn many new words over the years. I have to say that my favorite is tintinnabulation. It is just an awesome word.  (I apologize for my punctuation as I seem to have lost a taste for it. I should attempt to pick it back up... )
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:50:55 pm
Well YEAH!! That way I could just be wishy-washy, not commit myself to feeling like one or the other.... ::) ;D

Since I didn't want to assume you are female before, are you inadvertantly confirming it now?  :P  

Really?  :o  You said that??
;D  :thumbsup:
Did I say THIS already?  BAD DOG!!!

I did say "didn't want to assume..." as I'm aware of "wishy-washy" males as well and was iintentionally avoiding a stereotypical assumption despite the stereo being on so loud.  And yes, you did say "bad dog" previously however, 'falcons fly, bad dogs don't get sucked into jet engines'?

*crickets chirping* *FLIES BUZZING*......around big piles of  :bs:

Now you're just flirting shamelessly.  :bootyshake:
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 01:55:46 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::) 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:57:47 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?

Actually your entire intro to this topic had me literally laughing out loud!

Ah, well that's good then. :)  I'd thought you were referring to some of the humorous bits posted by others that I might have missed while posting replies to others.

So, as to the subject of this thread, have you any of your in-depth insights in that regard?

Since I am married to a man that is as skillful with language as you yourself is I have been forced to learn many new words over the years. I have to say that my favorite is tintinnabulation. It is just an awesome word. 

Just the ring bells or, do shiny things also fascinate?  :)

(I apologize for my punctuation as I seem to have lost a taste for it. I should attempt to pick it back up... )

That's no problem, in fact I've wondered why no one has mentioned my occasional tendency to mispunctuate, (not to be confused with 'Miss Punctuate' - winner of a little-known grammer pageant).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 01:59:47 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::) 

It has been said before that I seem to be 'a mystery, wrapped in an enigma, deep-fried in logic while having humor-Tourettes', (no, I didn't say it first but, I wish I did!).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 02, 2012, 02:03:26 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::) 
Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons sometimes those weapons do happen to be much like this :
(http://www.kaswords.com/ProductImages/medieval_staffs/axes/Alien-Battle-Axe-FMT-002-02.jpg)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 02, 2012, 02:07:25 pm
I have enjoyed all of the posts and have had a good laugh.  I knew coming back this afternoon would be a treat!

Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?

Actually your entire intro to this topic had me literally laughing out loud!

Ah, well that's good then. :)  I'd thought you were referring to some of the humorous bits posted by others that I might have missed while posting replies to others.

So, as to the subject of this thread, have you any of your in-depth insights in that regard?

Since I am married to a man that is as skillful with language as you yourself is I have been forced to learn many new words over the years. I have to say that my favorite is tintinnabulation. It is just an awesome word. 

Just the ring bells or, do shiny things also fascinate?  :)

(I apologize for my punctuation as I seem to have lost a taste for it. I should attempt to pick it back up... )

That's no problem, in fact I've wondered why no one has mentioned my occasional tendency to mispunctuate, (not to be confused with 'Miss Punctuate' - winner of a little-known grammer pageant).


The sound of the word, the sound of the bells, and the happy feeling hearing them and or saying the word lol! And yes I like shiny, glittery things. My husband claims I am a cat. 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 02:35:21 pm
The sound of the word, the sound of the bells, and the happy feeling hearing them and or saying the word lol! And yes I like shiny, glittery things. My husband claims I am a cat. 

I'm unsure whether or not your husband is indicating that you're more of a magpie than a cat however, no doubt he meant it in a nice way. :)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 02:37:41 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::) 

Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons sometimes those weapons do happen to be much like this :
(http://www.kaswords.com/ProductImages/medieval_staffs/axes/Alien-Battle-Axe-FMT-002-02.jpg)

Humbug; "The pen is not mightier than the sword unless one stabs another in the eye with a pen before any swordplay." -- anon
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 02, 2012, 02:42:14 pm
'Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?'  Falcon9

Falcon9, Is this sentence dumbing-down or wising-up?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 02:46:57 pm
'Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?' - Falcon9


Falcon9, Is this sentence dumbing-down or wising-up?

It's a question, (a sentence ends in a period). <-- that was a 'wising-up' encouragement.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 03:11:15 pm
Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons sometimes those weapons.......

Well for crap's sake, Cuppycake.....(yes-a rhyme!)

I KNOW he's not mean.....I surely wouldn't be giving him s**t about being a BIG MEANIE, and generally harassing him all the time if he WAS.
(I would probably avoid him, and all the topics he posts to, if that WAS the case)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 03:13:55 pm
I KNOW he's not mean.....I surely wouldn't be giving him s**t about being a BIG MEANIE, and generally harassing him all the time if he WAS.
(I would probably avoid him, and all the topics he posts to, if that WAS the case)

There is nothing to fear, not even fear itself, (phobophobia).  ;D
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: champak97 on May 02, 2012, 03:34:59 pm
I enjoy reading your posts falcon9. :wave:. I dont think you are mean, you just enjoy showing off your articulateness, through your posts.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 03:35:31 pm
Huh?.......
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 03:47:54 pm
I enjoy reading your posts falcon9. :wave:. I dont think you are mean, you just enjoy showing off your articulateness, through your posts.

Thanks but, I'm not "showing off" - I actually speak this way out loud, (sometimes to the dismay of people I'm speaking with).  All of my employment opportunities have required a certain degree of articulation, (whether textual or verbal), so I began acquiring that ability at an early age and am always refining it.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 03:49:54 pm
Huh?.......

That's hilariously concise, 'walks'.  

Now aren't you glad your ancestors weren't riding elephants and charming cobras out of baskets to confuse Columbus as to where he actually ended-up?
{... although that would have been extremely hilarious ...}
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 04:11:57 pm
Huh?.......

That's hilariously concise, 'walks'.  

Now aren't you glad your ancestors weren't riding elephants and charming cobras out of baskets to confuse Columbus as to where he actually ended-up?
{... although that would have been extremely hilarious ...}
They weren't??? humm.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 04:18:55 pm
Huh?.......

That's hilariously concise, 'walks'.  

Now aren't you glad your ancestors weren't riding elephants and charming cobras out of baskets to confuse Columbus as to where he actually ended-up?
{... although that would have been extremely hilarious ...}

They weren't??? humm.

Sorry, I did assume they didn't take the long way around in getting to the north american continent and that they didn't ride elephants, (carrying baskets of cobras), with them.  If, however, you happen to be directly from India - disregard the previous.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 02, 2012, 04:28:58 pm
"Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?' - Falcon9


Falcon9, Is this sentence dumbing-down or wising-up?  loulizlee

It's a question, (a sentence ends in a period). <-- that was a 'wising-up' encouragement.  Falcon9"


Oops, sorry.  I wasn't referring to whether it was a declarative sentence or a question.  My bad!!  I just thought it should be 'were there' instead of 'were they."
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Abrupt on May 02, 2012, 04:33:40 pm
You should speak to your audience.  

In my writing courses I was often advised to "eschew verbosity", but I still find myself often exhibiting that tendency.  I think we 'post' like we tend to speak (and in forums such as these when working with reply style posting it is more common to write in the manner you typically speak as you don't get the voice feedback and visual cues that you would in person that causes you to adjust your speech to who you were speaking to.  If your audience doesn't comprehend what you are saying it is more likely that you are using poor communication skills (even if your words might be precise and fitting in other venues).  If you wish to communicate your ideas, it is up to you to do this, not the audience to interpret them.  Being overly complex or using words unfamiliar to the audience can only cause your message to be lost.  Speaking in a manner that your target understands should never be considered as "dumbing-down" and such would actually count as "wising-up".

Some people might think the excessive use of 'big words' (as they are often called) is a sign of arrogance, and in person it might be as there would be cues that could be observed to indicate adjustments were needed.  On these forums, though, such things are not evident and even if one or two people mention something along the lines suggesting difficulty comprehending it is often the case that such things are stated in a way that doesn't encourage their target to adjust.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 04:39:59 pm
'Out of curiousity, were they any particular ones which tickled you?' - Falcon9


Falcon9, Is this sentence dumbing-down or wising-up?

It's a question, (a sentence ends in a period). <-- that was a 'wising-up' encouragement.

Oops, sorry.  I wasn't referring to whether it was a declarative sentence or a question.  My bad!!  I just thought it should be 'were there' instead of 'were they."

It should have been "were there", yes.  You missed several more of my typos, (these stem from a mild form of dyslexia, rather than 'dumbness', which is relatively common in those with above-average I.Q.s). Since you typed the question and posted it, my reply was relevant to your error, whether you were referring to it or not, the reply was.

Thanks for pointing the one out though, did it make you proud?  It certainly did nothing to remove the patina of religious superstition which taints your motivation for posting tangentially to the context of this thread, (neither does it constitute 'evidence' of wisdom nor, 'dumdum').

 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 04:52:29 pm
Huh?.......

That's hilariously concise, 'walks'.  

Now aren't you glad your ancestors weren't riding elephants and charming cobras out of baskets to confuse Columbus as to where he actually ended-up?
{... although that would have been extremely hilarious ...}

They weren't??? humm.

Sorry, I did assume they didn't take the long way around in getting to the north american continent and that they didn't ride elephants, (carrying baskets of cobras), with them.  If, however, you happen to be directly from India - disregard the previous.
Well according to my Nations creation stories, it was indeed a very long trip.....no elephants cobras or any of that, just a bit of space travel ;)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 05:07:38 pm
You should speak to your audience.  

I'm not a paid speaker nor do I consider FC participants to be 'my audience'.  They're members of FC who may or may not choose to read or reply to forum posts.  I don't treat the forums as a 'soapbox', as you seem to do.

In my writing courses I was often advised to "eschew verbosity"...

There's a certain 'irony' to that specific advice, (I presume you know of it since you wrote it - never mind redefining "irony").
 
... but I still find myself often exhibiting that tendency.

Yep, that goes for the both of us.  That's usually called, "being windy", aye?
 
I think we 'post' like we tend to speak (and in forums such as these when working with reply style posting it is more common to write in the manner you typically speak as you don't get the voice feedback and visual cues that you would in person that causes you to adjust your speech to who you were speaking to.

I can essentially concur with that observation.
 
If your audience doesn't comprehend what you are saying it is more likely that you are using poor communication skills (even if your words might be precise and fitting in other venues).  

That contention, I don't concur with completely.  That is, communication is a three-part process consisting of the transmission of the communication, the medium in which that transmission is communicated and the receiver of the communicated transmission.  The responsibility of the 'transmitter', (the one sending the first part of the communication), is to send it in an intelligible form.  That form may consist of colloquial English, (or other language), or varying degrees of precise/complex language.  The "medium" of transmission in this regard is the language itself.  The sender assumes the receiver can understand that language otherwise, no communication is possible.  If the receiver generally understands the language but, not the specific usage or wording involved, the sender can either "dumb it down" colloquially or, not do so.  At this point, it's the responsibility of the one receiving the communication to make sense of it, (how could this be otherwise?  The sender is hardly responsible for the receiver's comprehension abilities - even if they personally taught the receiver how to comprehend the language, it's still up to the receiver to learn and incorporate such knowledge within their own mind).

If you wish to communicate your ideas, it is up to you to do this, not the audience to interpret them.

Obviously, I've disagreed with your declaration and stated why, above.
 
Being overly complex or using words unfamiliar to the audience can only cause your message to be lost.  Speaking in a manner that your target understands should never be considered as "dumbing-down" and such would actually count as "wising-up".

As I previously stated, I don't consider those who read posts to be a 'target audience' when I'm replying to their posts.  Nor do I agree with your contention which inverts "dumbing-down" and "wising-up" because it's illogical.  Changing a message from what someone else might consider to be 'too complex/using words which are too large' certainly is "dumbing-down" a message, (and condescending to boot).  My perspective being that you're not "wising-up" someone else if they aren't expending the effort to 'wise-up' themselves; you're spoon-feeding them.
  
Some people might think the excessive use of 'big words' (as they are often called) is a sign of arrogance ...

That assumption would be unwarranted unless there were evidence to support such a conclusion, (which excludes mere subjective perceptions and any resulting 'opinions' stemming from such internal bias).  Conversely, it is more generally common for people who complain about others using "big words" to be somewhat insecure about being unable to completely comprehend what is actually being said, (even if they have some vague idea, this 'feeling' can lead to another one; inadaquacy).  

Go ahead and be a proponent of 'spoon-feeding'; I'll stick with the, (possibly unrealistic), process of encouraging others to get their own 'spoons'. Remember The Matrix; there is no spoon, there is only you. <--paraphrasing
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 05:09:28 pm
Well according to my Nations creation stories, it was indeed a very long trip.....no elephants cobras or any of that, just a bit of space travel ;)

Anasazi Pueblo ancestors?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 05:13:30 pm
Well according to my Nations creation stories, it was indeed a very long trip.....no elephants cobras or any of that, just a bit of space travel ;)

Anasazi Pueblo ancestors?
No, I am Tsalagi, although I do live among the Pueblos now.....Taos Pueblo being the nearest...about 12 miles or so.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 05:16:49 pm
Well according to my Nations creation stories, it was indeed a very long trip.....no elephants cobras or any of that, just a bit of space travel ;)

Anasazi Pueblo ancestors?

No, I am Tsalagi, although I do live among the Pueblos now.....Taos Pueblo being the nearest...about 12 miles or so.

That's probably different than the Cherokee creation myth commonly-known to us 'white-eyes', (unless Tsalagi isn't a Cherokee tribe as I'd previously thought).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 05:26:57 pm
Well according to my Nations creation stories, it was indeed a very long trip.....no elephants cobras or any of that, just a bit of space travel ;)

Anasazi Pueblo ancestors?

No, I am Tsalagi, although I do live among the Pueblos now.....Taos Pueblo being the nearest...about 12 miles or so.

That's probably different than the Cherokee creation myth commonly-known to us 'white-eyes', (unless Tsalagi isn't a Cherokee tribe as I'd previously thought).
Cherokee is correct. That name is widely accepted by the Nations but I just have a personal issue with it. Chip on my shoulder I guess you would say and as I have been accused of in here in the past. Actually our language has no "r" based sounds so it is said that we pronounce it Tsalagi which is pronounced Cha-luh-gee in the Giduwa (eastern band) dialect and Cha-luh-gay in the Otali dialect which is most common in Oklahoma. Another version of the story is that back in the day some European asked a member of the Muskogee (Creek) Nation who we were and they said Tsalagi but the Euro. had difficulty pronouncing it and it became corrupted into Cherokee. I figure I will stick with the traditional pronounciation not needing some "non" telling me what to call myself.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 05:31:28 pm
Cherokee is correct. That name is widely accepted by the Nations but I just have a personal issue with it. Chip on my shoulder I guess you would say and as I have been accused of in here in the past. Actually our language has no "r" based sounds so it is said that we pronounce it Tsalagi which is pronounced Cha-luh-gee in the Giduwa (eastern band) dialect and Cha-luh-gay in the Otali dialect which is most common in Oklahoma. Another version of the story is that back in the day some European asked a member of the Muskogee (Creek) Nation who we were and they said Tsalagi but the Euro. had difficulty pronouncing it and it became corrupted into Cherokee. I figure I will stick with the traditional pronounciation not needing some "non" telling me what to call myself.

I can see where the pronounciation of "Tsalagi" became warped in "Cherokee" from your description of events.  So, I'm still unable to determine if the Tsalagi creation story is equivalent to or, varies from the Cherokee version.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 05:36:48 pm
Cherokee is correct. That name is widely accepted by the Nations but I just have a personal issue with it. Chip on my shoulder I guess you would say and as I have been accused of in here in the past. Actually our language has no "r" based sounds so it is said that we pronounce it Tsalagi which is pronounced Cha-luh-gee in the Giduwa (eastern band) dialect and Cha-luh-gay in the Otali dialect which is most common in Oklahoma. Another version of the story is that back in the day some European asked a member of the Muskogee (Creek) Nation who we were and they said Tsalagi but the Euro. had difficulty pronouncing it and it became corrupted into Cherokee. I figure I will stick with the traditional pronounciation not needing some "non" telling me what to call myself.

I can see where the pronounciation of "Tsalagi" became warped in "Cherokee" from your description of events.  So, I'm still unable to determine if the Tsalagi creation story is equivalent to or, varies from the Cherokee version.
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 05:46:53 pm
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 02, 2012, 05:59:49 pm
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Thank you.

Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 02, 2012, 07:45:44 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::)  

Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons......

I enjoy reading your posts falcon9. :wave:. I dont think you are mean.......

For crying out LOUD......you people can't POSSIBLY think I was really calling him MEAN....I was poking fun at him, and HE was well aware of that (although he COULD have spoken up in my defense here.  >:( .  Bad dog.)

Anyway, the fact that I was JOKING was rather OBVIOUS, so kindly give this "He's not mean" line a rest.

After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word). 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 08:56:10 pm
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::)  

Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons......

I enjoy reading your posts falcon9. :wave:. I dont think you are mean.......

For crying out LOUD......you people can't POSSIBLY think I was really calling him MEAN....I was poking fun at him, and HE was well aware of that (although he COULD have spoken up in my defense here.  >:( .  Bad dog.)

Anyway, the fact that I was JOKING was rather OBVIOUS, so kindly give this "He's not mean" line a rest.

Along the lines of _not_ dumbing-down my replies, the one I made to you, ('There is nothing to fear, not even fear itself, (phobophobia).  ;D' ), may have been too subtle to indicate that I was aware that you were joking.  Beyond that, I'd estimated that the ones you may have thought were referring to your joke had actually meant others.  Of course, that estimation may have been off the mark.  Innocent until demonstrated to be guilty? If it was/wasn't/seems like fun, the offending parties can be tased at an unknown future point.  That means you too, (unless you're settled down by now ... or, if I determine that it'd be fun to tase ya either way ... ) :bootyshake:


After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word).  

The tangential conversation caught my interest too, even if things were left vague.  That's how it goes sometimes, now how do you really feel concerning either 'dumbing-down' or, 'wising-up'?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 02, 2012, 09:07:30 pm
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).

Thank you.
Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

Assuming that much tradition is passed-down orally and that you're aware of the "telephone game" young people have played, (whisper something in one ear and pass it along to the next ear and so on until at least nine people have participated ... the 9th person then says whatever it was aloud - which must be a long sentence/question).  If these assumptions apply, would you estimate that some elements may have already been lost/mis-spoken over such a long period of oral-traditions?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 03, 2012, 07:54:45 am
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Thank you.

Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

I regret to say I do not know much about my Choctaw Indian family. I do know they are responsible for the use of filé powder (sassafras) in gumbo. I think I was more influenced by the Cajun-French culture around me growing up then by my actual family and it shows in my cooking. I do use filé powder instead of okra in my gumbo though !
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 03, 2012, 07:55:24 am
Whoa!!! For being a serious guy (or a BIG MEANIE mean guy), you're making an awful LOT of funnies here....

You're going to have to rebuild your reputation if you're not careful! ::)  

Bah he is not mean. He is direct. Using words as weapons......

I enjoy reading your posts falcon9. :wave:. I dont think you are mean.......

For crying out LOUD......you people can't POSSIBLY think I was really calling him MEAN....I was poking fun at him, and HE was well aware of that (although he COULD have spoken up in my defense here.  >:( .  Bad dog.)

Anyway, the fact that I was JOKING was rather OBVIOUS, so kindly give this "He's not mean" line a rest.

After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word). 

No I didn't think you were !
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 08:35:17 am
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).

Thank you.
Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

Assuming that much tradition is passed-down orally and that you're aware of the "telephone game" young people have played, (whisper something in one ear and pass it along to the next ear and so on until at least nine people have participated ... the 9th person then says whatever it was aloud - which must be a long sentence/question).  If these assumptions apply, would you estimate that some elements may have already been lost/mis-spoken over such a long period of oral-traditions?
There are certain tribal members, of my Nation, that are tasked with learning, memorizing and telling of stories that have been passed down for many generations. Stories often include names of specific Ancestors as well as place settings that are local and usually very familiar. This gives the effect of being much more familiar on a personal level,to said Ancestor then would happen if a more vague reference was mentioned. This is one of the reasons being relocated is such a tragic event. Along with the belief that a persons spirit can not rest unless being buried in the soil made up by the remains of the Ancestors.

Story keepers are allowed license to add to the stories so in answer to your question, yes it would be possible that some bits have been lost along the way, however, in most instances, it isn't extreamly likely. Reason being is that when one is learning the stories they are not allowed to tell them until they have memorized them to the satisfaction of their mentor. Not to say that it never happens.

Getting back to our connection with our environment, we hold the belief that every thing is cyclical. Meaning enter connected and moving in a never ending cycle. We are conceived as the result of biological substances of our parents. It is what we are made of, therefore, we are in reality a part of our parents and in turn all of their forbears. We get our sustenance from products of the soil, which is made up of, and nourished by, the remains of our Ancestors. Thereby re-enforcing the connection in that way. It takes the sun, soil and water to nourish plants, which in turn nourish us as well as the fourlegged and other of our Relatives, which we also partake of. When we harvest any food item we are taught to not only always give thanks but also to give something in return, which may be some sacred offering and/or returning any by products which we don't consume in some way, back to the soil. So we see that all of these things are connected and very necessary to each of our survival. We believe that every organism has some important function so is for that reason sacred and not to be disrespected or attempts made to harm them. That said, I will mash every fly I can in my home lol.

Anyway, this is straying a bit far from your question so I will stop here. Perhaps someone, will get a little something from my musing.....
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 08:44:12 am
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Thank you.

Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

I regret to say I do not know much about my Choctaw Indian family. I do know they are responsible for the use of filé powder (sassafras) in gumbo. I think I was more influenced by the Cajun-French culture around me growing up then by my actual family and it shows in my cooking. I do use filé powder instead of okra in my gumbo though !
sassafrass or as we know it, kastaste or kanasdatsi, was the first wild plant that I was taught of, by my Mother. It was traditionally used for treating bronchitis, in a poultice for sore eyes, in drinks along with pine bark for endurance etc.
My family used it as a spring tonic. I just love the taste of the tea and try to keep a supply on hand. Back east I would harvest it myself but since moving west I am forced to order it from a friend who is an herb dealer. I generally get around 2 or 3 pounds at a time. I drink it often as well as gift it to others.

If I may ask, are your Relatives of the Oklahoma Choctaw, or the Mississippi band? I may know some of them or atleast be able to put you in touch with someone from your Nation, if you would like.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Barbaralynne on May 03, 2012, 08:58:01 am
Dumbing-down or wising-up?

My thought(s) would be "pot luck"...    

This is a forum.  No one in here is perfect.  No one in here knows EVERYTHING.  Every single person in this forum knows at least one thing that someone else does not, everyone "brings something different to the table".      

Everyone is free to contribute and share, and may discover new friendships but insults, criticisms, name-calling, "calling-outs", etc.  are probably going to result in "food-fights".

(http://dl2.glitter-graphics.net/pub/1325/1325012c6523fh4az.gif) (http://www.glitter-graphics.com)

@duroz---your post above, nicely done! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 03, 2012, 09:04:17 am
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Thank you.

Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

I regret to say I do not know much about my Choctaw Indian family. I do know they are responsible for the use of filé powder (sassafras) in gumbo. I think I was more influenced by the Cajun-French culture around me growing up then by my actual family and it shows in my cooking. I do use filé powder instead of okra in my gumbo though !
sassafrass or as we know it, kastaste or kanasdatsi, was the first wild plant that I was taught of, by my Mother. It was traditionally used for treating bronchitis, in a poultice for sore eyes, in drinks along with pine bark for endurance etc.
My family used it as a spring tonic. I just love the taste of the tea and try to keep a supply on hand. Back east I would harvest it myself but since moving west I am forced to order it from a friend who is an herb dealer. I generally get around 2 or 3 pounds at a time. I drink it often as well as gift it to others.

If I may ask, are your Relatives of the Oklahoma Choctaw, or the Mississippi band? I may know some of them or atleast be able to put you in touch with someone from your Nation, if you would like.
I have never had it as a tea. I think I would like that ! Mississippi. :) I grew up on the coast. My uncle has all the information for them but I moved to Atlanta and haven't seen him in a long while.  You are an awesome person !
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Barbaralynne on May 03, 2012, 09:06:28 am
 We are all entitled to our opinions, and how would we learn anything if we weren't exposed to other people and views. Beyond that, a person with a healthy mind can laugh at himself.

I don't often agree with what certain people say on hear, but I read their posts, Because I want to know other views. I have always found them intelligently put, even if I don't see things the same. And yes,I say a little prayer.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 09:10:17 am
It would depend on what story you are referencing. There are several of our own and many more falsely attributed to us. I generally don't speak much publicly on these types of things and I could get into the why's although it would be a bit of a lengthy explanation, however, the story I am speaking of tells of ancients coming coming here from "the Sky Vault" which means basically from some where in space.

That might be similar to some Anasazi creation stories which I'm aware of, or not.  It's understandable that you'd prefer not to discuss them publically, (although you did bring it up initially *chuckle*).  I was mainly curious from a 'comparative myth' perspective, (in that these are not considered to be 'myth' by those who believe in them).  It's difficult to discuss specifics when only generalities are available however, I'm going to defer this preference to you since your creation story isn't as widely-known as some others, (out of a respect for privacy).
Thank you.

Yes I did vaguely refer to it lol.

As you are well aware, many people are not as diligent as yourself in striving to gather true facts.
Many times less scrupulous people will get on some ego trip after hearing some tid bits of something and then make up huge elaborate stories to add to them, thinking it makes them look intelligent.

This has the result of much mis-information.

There are many many people with legit Native ancestry who were never around the culture but are trying to find their way back. They hear these bogus stories and believe them, then retell them. Now you have authentic NDNs spreading these stories and repping them as legit.

Many people say that the way to preserving our culture is to share it. Many of us have a different stance on that. I am not against sharing, just that I am very careful in where and to whom I do speak on these things with, as my way of attempting protect them.

In my view, when/if the authentic culture is lost, then assimilation will be complete, resulting in there being no more NDNs ever....we will all then simply be Americans.

I regret to say I do not know much about my Choctaw Indian family. I do know they are responsible for the use of filé powder (sassafras) in gumbo. I think I was more influenced by the Cajun-French culture around me growing up then by my actual family and it shows in my cooking. I do use filé powder instead of okra in my gumbo though !
sassafrass or as we know it, kastaste or kanasdatsi, was the first wild plant that I was taught of, by my Mother. It was traditionally used for treating bronchitis, in a poultice for sore eyes, in drinks along with pine bark for endurance etc.
My family used it as a spring tonic. I just love the taste of the tea and try to keep a supply on hand. Back east I would harvest it myself but since moving west I am forced to order it from a friend who is an herb dealer. I generally get around 2 or 3 pounds at a time. I drink it often as well as gift it to others.

If I may ask, are your Relatives of the Oklahoma Choctaw, or the Mississippi band? I may know some of them or atleast be able to put you in touch with someone from your Nation, if you would like.
I have never had it as a tea. I think I would like that ! Mississippi. :) I grew up on the coast. My uncle has all the information for them but I moved to Atlanta and haven't seen him in a long while.  You are an awesome person !
If your Uncle has all the information, he would probably be the person to talk to. Why not get in touch?
I dated a woman once who was from the Mississippi band. She lives in San Diego now...didn't work out :(

Once you get in touch with your tribe, see if you can find the Chief that made the opening pitch in a Braves game a few years back, and smack tha *bleep* out of him for me, lol J/K....that was kinna rude tho. I forget now what his name was.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 02:01:38 pm
There are certain tribal members, of my Nation, that are tasked with learning, memorizing and telling of stories that have been passed down for many generations. Stories often include names of specific Ancestors as well as place settings that are local and usually very familiar. This gives the effect of being much more familiar on a personal level,to said Ancestor then would happen if a more vague reference was mentioned. This is one of the reasons being relocated is such a tragic event. Along with the belief that a persons spirit can not rest unless being buried in the soil made up by the remains of the Ancestors.

Story keepers are allowed license to add to the stories so in answer to your question, yes it would be possible that some bits have been lost along the way, however, in most instances, it isn't extreamly likely. Reason being is that when one is learning the stories they are not allowed to tell them until they have memorized them to the satisfaction of their mentor. Not to say that it never happens.

Understood.  My previous questions, (as exemplified by the "telephone game" example), regarded such mundanely-common things as memory-loss and poor hearing/mis-hearing stories told.  Even when repeated back to the one passing an oral tradition along, it does happen that the new story teller grows old and some details will slip/be altered or omitted.  The point of all this being that stories can and do change, (whether or not the core essence of the stories remains the same or, has also subtlely altered in the course of the process is the crux of my inquiry).


Getting back to our connection with our environment, we hold the belief that every thing is cyclical. Meaning enter connected and moving in a never ending cycle. We are conceived as the result of biological substances of our parents. It is what we are made of, therefore, we are in reality a part of our parents and in turn all of their forbears. We get our sustenance from products of the soil, which is made up of, and nourished by, the remains of our Ancestors. Thereby re-enforcing the connection in that way. It takes the sun, soil and water to nourish plants, which in turn nourish us as well as the fourlegged and other of our Relatives, which we also partake of. When we harvest any food item we are taught to not only always give thanks but also to give something in return, which may be some sacred offering and/or returning any by products which we don't consume in some way, back to the soil. So we see that all of these things are connected and very necessary to each of our survival. We believe that every organism has some important function so is for that reason sacred and not to be disrespected or attempts made to harm them. That said, I will mash every fly I can in my home lol.

Anyway, this is straying a bit far from your question so I will stop here. Perhaps someone, will get a little something from my musing.....

I appreciate the time you've taken to expound a bit upon your culture.  While we might go into the general subject of "animism" as it relates to such cultures, (not just yours, specifically), I don't regard this portion of the discussion thread as tangential since it falls under the "wising-up" context of the thread.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 02:48:41 pm
I recall an instance when a person from Canada opined, after hearing some of my beliefs, that I was an animist. I have never researched what exactly that is so really couldn't say.

As far as stories "evolving" I would assume some probably have, although without having some original text or equivalent, to compare modern versions too, I guess it would be speculation, however probable, to say.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 03:00:40 pm
I recall an instance when a person from Canada opined, after hearing some of my beliefs, that I was an animist. I have never researched what exactly that is so really couldn't say.

"Animism, (from Latin anima "soul, life"), refers to the belief that non-human entities are spiritual beings, or at least embody some kind of life-principle. Animism encompasses the beliefs that there is no separation between the spiritual and physical (or material) world, and souls or spirits exist, not only in humans, but also in all other animals, plants, rocks, geographic features such as mountains or rivers, or other entities of the natural environment. Animism may further attribute souls to abstract concepts such as words, true names, or metaphors in mythology."
-- from Wikipedia

My perspective on animism is similar however, extends into the underlying concepts of "magic", (e.g., ancient cultures), and as being the basis of formal religions.

As far as stories "evolving" I would assume some probably have, although without having some original text or equivalent, to compare modern versions too, I guess it would be speculation, however probable, to say.

It is specualtion that such stories evolve, (although there is considerable evidence extant that many, many _other_ stories/old tales have evolved), but then it is also a speculation that they haven't.  As you indicated, there would have to be comparative evidence available, (beyond two generations of oral traditions and interpreting cave drawings through current perspectives).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 03:09:32 pm
I recall an instance when a person from Canada opined, after hearing some of my beliefs, that I was an animist. I have never researched what exactly that is so really couldn't say.

"Animism, (from Latin anima "soul, life"), refers to the belief that non-human entities are spiritual beings, or at least embody some kind of life-principle. Animism encompasses the beliefs that there is no separation between the spiritual and physical (or material) world, and souls or spirits exist, not only in humans, but also in all other animals, plants, rocks, geographic features such as mountains or rivers, or other entities of the natural environment. Animism may further attribute souls to abstract concepts such as words, true names, or metaphors in mythology."
-- from Wikipedia

My perspective on animism is similar however, extends into the underlying concepts of "magic", (e.g., ancient cultures), and as being the basis of formal religions.

As far as stories "evolving" I would assume some probably have, although without having some original text or equivalent, to compare modern versions too, I guess it would be speculation, however probable, to say.

It is specualtion that such stories evolve, (although there is considerable evidence extant that many, many _other_ stories/old tales have evolved), but then it is also a speculation that they haven't.  As you indicated, there would have to be comparative evidence available, (beyond two generations of oral traditions and interpreting cave drawings through current perspectives).
Ummm, most of that definition sounds a bit familiar however the "no separation between the spiritual and the physical worlds I would part from.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 03:24:05 pm
"Animism, (from Latin anima "soul, life"), refers to the belief that non-human entities are spiritual beings, or at least embody some kind of life-principle. Animism encompasses the beliefs that there is no separation between the spiritual and physical (or material) world, and souls or spirits exist, not only in humans, but also in all other animals, plants, rocks, geographic features such as mountains or rivers, or other entities of the natural environment. Animism may further attribute souls to abstract concepts such as words, true names, or metaphors in mythology."
-- from Wikipedia

My perspective on animism is similar however, extends into the underlying concepts of "magic", (e.g., ancient cultures), and as being the basis of formal religions.

Ummm, most of that definition sounds a bit familiar however the "no separation between the spiritual and the physical worlds I would part from.

As I said, one of my interests in that concept regards how animism relates to early conceptions of "magic" and religion.  For instance, in order for such ancient concepts of "magic" to 'work', practitioners appeared to require some unseen connections between the "spiritual" and physical worlds, (as did/does most religious concepts).  I considered this requirement to consist of a 'separate, yet connected' understanding, (applying to both magic & religion).  Either there is no such connection or, there is.  If there isn't, that would seem to preclude the efficacy of "magic" and the basis of many religions.  If there is such a connection, it is difficult to demonstrate without demonstrating 'animistic magical' results, (or, the religionist parallel of 'prayer' results).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on May 03, 2012, 03:32:49 pm
Along the lines of _not_ dumbing-down my replies, the one I made to you, ('There is nothing to fear, not even fear itself, (phobophobia).  ;D' ), may have been too subtle to indicate that I was aware that you were joking.  Beyond that, I'd estimated that the ones you may have thought were referring to your joke had actually meant others.  Of course, that estimation may have been off the mark.  Innocent until demonstrated to be guilty? If it was/wasn't/seems like fun, the offending parties can be tased at an unknown future point.  That means you too, (unless you're settled down by now ... or, if I determine that it'd be fun to tase ya either way ... ) :bootyshake:


After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word).  

The tangential conversation caught my interest too, even if things were left vague.  That's how it goes sometimes, now how do you really feel concerning either 'dumbing-down' or, 'wising-up'?

I just had time to briefly rush through latest posts here, didn't get to really read much of them, so I want to be sure to get back on here later this evening. I am looking forward to reading more interesting posts from walksalone11 and bad dog.
Oh OOOPS I mean falcon9....gosh what was I thinking? ( ;D :bootyshake:  ;D 8))

Also comments from the quoted falcon9 post I feel the need to say SOMETHING about ::) .....and also respond to the dumb down wise up question.   

Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 03:58:10 pm
After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word).  

The tangential conversation caught my interest too, even if things were left vague.  That's how it goes sometimes, now how do you really feel concerning either 'dumbing-down' or, 'wising-up'?


I just had time to briefly rush through latest posts here, didn't get to really read much of them, so I want to be sure to get back on here later this evening. I am looking forward to reading more interesting posts from walksalone11 and bad dog.
Oh OOOPS I mean falcon9....gosh what was I thinking? ( ;D :bootyshake:  ;D 8))

Also comments from the quoted falcon9 post I feel the need to say SOMETHING about ::) .....and also respond to the dumb down wise up question.   

Okay, take your time as always.  Also, if you keep trying to designate me as "bad dog", I may have to start referring to you as 'good pussycat', (or something more insidious along those lines), you know.  As an apparent aside, we had a cat once who we'd named "bad dog" because she was such a good cat that she'd make a lousy dog.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 04:16:52 pm
Yeah thing about that Walks fella is that he is notorious for disappearing without warning for long stretches of time......
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 04:50:32 pm
Yeah thing about that Walks fella is that he is notorious for disappearing without warning for long stretches of time......

My current hypothesis regarding that is that "walksalone" may be off walking ... alone.  I could be in error; he might be walking with someone or, driving or nearly anything else but posting to an FC forum. :peace:
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 04:57:15 pm
Yeah thing about that Walks fella is that he is notorious for disappearing without warning for long stretches of time......

My current hypothesis regarding that is that "walksalone" may be off walking ... alone.  I could be in error; he might be walking with someone or, driving or nearly anything else but posting to an FC forum. :peace:
Or perhaps, he walks alone to the truck, drives into town to pick "someone" up, drives back, walks with said "someone" into the abode and then doing nearly any thing else but posting to a FC forum  :P

or.....perhaps not  ;D
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 05:04:29 pm
Yeah thing about that Walks fella is that he is notorious for disappearing without warning for long stretches of time......

My current hypothesis regarding that is that "walksalone" may be off walking ... alone.  I could be in error; he might be walking with someone or, driving or nearly anything else but posting to an FC forum. :peace:

Or perhaps, he walks alone to the truck, drives into town to pick "someone" up, drives back, walks with said "someone" into the abode and then doing nearly any thing else but posting to a FC forum  :P

or.....perhaps not  ;D

Either you haven't left yet or, she's waiting for you waiting on her.  Other possibilities spring to mind as well ... you could've said that you're going elk-hunting or even say nothing, (and leave mysteriously, only to return later, just as mysteriously).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 03, 2012, 05:08:42 pm
Yeah thing about that Walks fella is that he is notorious for disappearing without warning for long stretches of time......

My current hypothesis regarding that is that "walksalone" may be off walking ... alone.  I could be in error; he might be walking with someone or, driving or nearly anything else but posting to an FC forum. :peace:

Or perhaps, he walks alone to the truck, drives into town to pick "someone" up, drives back, walks with said "someone" into the abode and then doing nearly any thing else but posting to a FC forum  :P

or.....perhaps not  ;D

Either you haven't left yet or, she's waiting for you waiting on her.  Other possibilities spring to mind as well ... you could've said that you're going elk-hunting or even say nothing, (and leave mysteriously, only to return later, just as mysteriously).
no I'm still he
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 03, 2012, 05:13:03 pm
Or perhaps, he walks alone to the truck, drives into town to pick "someone" up, drives back, walks with said "someone" into the abode and then doing nearly any thing else but posting to a FC forum  :P

or.....perhaps not  ;D

Either you haven't left yet or, she's waiting for you waiting on her.  Other possibilities spring to mind as well ... you could've said that you're going elk-hunting or even say nothing, (and leave mysteriously, only to return later, just as mysteriously).

no I'm still he

I'd figured that and meant that she might be waiting for you, (he), to pick her up.  The only way to know is to call her or, get in your truck and go find her, (I have no idea who she is - this is all speculation based on your posted suppositions).  Whatever you do, enjoy it, man.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sammywantsya on May 04, 2012, 07:24:28 am
THIS IS A GPT SITE its not meant to be intelligent. some of us arent that smart but when you call someone out and cant leave this alone you go out of your way to berate them including me where i was sensitive about somethings and then stalks me out of the GODs forum and insulted us from there. its get to a point where its gettn annoying and creepy.. i also agree what we calling you out is some what childish too so its both ways for both of us...

i do however have an open mind about your opinions and difference but calling me and idiot hypocryte and a liar ?... how can you call me those things when you yourself dont even know me but when i spoke my mind about religion topics that has no intention to debate you? you started to argue with me then it gets to argueing and picking names at each other like a broken record. i replied back becauuse you mentioned me thats how it got started from there.

 this will be my last post and gonna ignore your future comments from now on seriously. but you have to admit what you did with others are wrong by calling someone names... and i will do the same. i was thinking about this you aint a bad dude but there's a thin line where you have to limit your replies.. like i said before on the other topic we dont hate you you just need to work on that tone... also you gotta remember we have underage kids here as well..

PS if you just wanna post your likes about religion go ahead im not gonna touch it, but where i post somewhere else please dont comment that mentions me because itw as not to debate against you ... DEAL ? lets start over and call it truths i dont like to be named idiot hypocrite and a liar from now on..
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 04, 2012, 08:49:18 am
Or perhaps, he walks alone to the truck, drives into town to pick "someone" up, drives back, walks with said "someone" into the abode and then doing nearly any thing else but posting to a FC forum  :P

or.....perhaps not  ;D

Either you haven't left yet or, she's waiting for you waiting on her.  Other possibilities spring to mind as well ... you could've said that you're going elk-hunting or even say nothing, (and leave mysteriously, only to return later, just as mysteriously).

no I'm still he

I'd figured that and meant that she might be waiting for you, (he), to pick her up.  The only way to know is to call her or, get in your truck and go find her, (I have no idea who she is - this is all speculation based on your posted suppositions).  Whatever you do, enjoy it, man.
Naa, that was going to say "I'm still here" but I had to disappear for a minute before I got thru typing the reply.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 04, 2012, 08:56:42 am
Cuppycake.....I was thinking last night(oh come on, quit laughing...I do that sometimes) and remembered that atleast as late as 2008 the Mississippi band of Choctaw had no blood quantum restrictions for eligibility for enrollment, therefor, if you can prove that any of your family members have ever been on their rolls, you can qualify to become enrolled. These things do some times change so you would of course have to verify that this rule is still in effect.

I would like to say, not to you specifically, but to anyone who may entertain the idea of seeking enrollment in any Indian Nation, to do so with it in mind of what you can bring to the tribe, not what benefits you may or may not qualify for.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 01:27:54 pm
THIS IS A GPT SITE its not meant to be intelligent. some of us arent that smart ...

Neither is this site intended to be unintelligent.  Tacitly, it's for all sorts of people, regardless of race, stupidity, intelligence, or creed.

but when you call someone out and cant leave this alone you go out of your way to berate them including me...

Yes, starting a calling-out thread to specifically 'flame' another FC member certainly does include _you_ doing so before. I haven't started any such calling-out threads.  Now, you're "stalking", (under your misconception of that term), the same FC member in a debate+discuss thread.  As it happens, I'm that FC member which you've unwisely chosen to "follow" to d+d.  May whatever hypothetical deity you pretend exists have hypothetical mercy on your hypothetical 'soul'.

...where i was sensitive about somethings and then stalks me out of the GODs forum

There is no "GODs forum" on FC.  Who can tell what you may or may not be "sensitive" about in advance?  No one can read your 'mind', not even you apparently.

...and insulted us from there. its get to a point where its gettn annoying and creepy...

Such complaints wanting to implicitly censor those who don't agree with your religious beliefs and propaganda are indeed "annoying and creepy" however, you've as much freedom to post such crap as others have to oppose it.  Tough break, eh?

i also agree what we calling you out is some what childish too so its both ways for both of us...

No, it's not "both ways" since you posted a calling-out thread, I have not. Although your admission to being childish begs the question; are you a teenaged child?

i do however have an open mind about your opinions and difference ...

Given the archived record of your previously-posted replies and responses, your claim is manifestly false, (a lie contradicted by your _own_ prior words).

... but calling me and idiot hypocryte and a liar ?... how can you call me those things when you yourself dont even know me but when i spoke my mind about religion topics (?)

No one needs to know you if they are going solely by what you've posted when they are contending the content of those posts. Since the content of the several posts you've made is demonstrative evidence supporting the contentions that you've lied, been hypocritical and often post in such a manner that the definition of "idiot" does indeed apply, (rather than these being speciously-empty 'insults'), the shoes fit.  Undoubtedly those 'shoes' are unconfortable for you to wear however, you do seem to choose putting them on and posting to FC in them quite often.

...that has no intention to debate you?

If you have no intention of debating or discussing this matter, why are you posting it in the debate+discussion subforum?  See, that's what leads to the conclusion that you're an "idiot", for instance.

you started to argue with me ...

You mean, you posted some nonsense initially and I subsequently replied in dissent/contention. That happens when people disagree.  What is unlikely to happen is having contentious posts 'censored' because you don't like the replies.

this will be my last post and gonna ignore your future comments from now on seriously.

Oh, another 'hit-and-run' rant where you want to rant and then avoid backing up your ranted complaints.  I see.  While this is a cowardly tactic, so is using the "ignore" after whining and retreating.  If you are actually going to ignore my posts, naturally this would include not talking about them/me to others in a passive-aggressive indirect way.  Should you nevertheless do so, you're already aware that my disapproval of such cowardice can be relentless.

i was thinking about this you aint a bad dude but there's a thin line where you have to limit your replies.. like i said before on the other topic we dont hate you you just need to work on that tone...

You are not an FC moderator and certianly don't possess the ability to censor the posts of others as those comments inherently suggest. Fortunately, all that needs be done to to ignore your 'terrorist demands' and proceed as before.

also you gotta remember we have underage kids here as well...

Even if you, (or others), are underage kids, FC now bleeps out any language inappropriate for them, (which I rarely, if ever, use anyway).

PS if you just wanna post your likes about religion go ahead im not gonna touch it, but where i post somewhere else please dont comment that mentions me ...

If you interject a post into a thread in which I choose to do the same, I generally quote in reply.  This is to keep who said what intact so that no one gets misquoted later on, (it isn't to specifically "mention" anyone however, I reserve the 'right' to respond to any comment in any thread).
You are not an FC moderator and certianly don't possess the ability to censor the posts of others as those comments inherently suggest. Fortunately, all that needs be done to to ignore your 'terrorist demands' and proceed as before.
 
... DEAL ?

No, 'this organisation does not comply with terrorist demands.'

lets start over and call it truths i dont like to be named idiot hypocrite and a liar from now on..

I'd suggest getting new 'shoes' then, since you often post in such a manner that the definition of "idiot" does indeed apply, (rather than these being speciously-empty 'insults'), the shoes fit.  Undoubtedly those 'shoes' are unconfortable for you to wear however, you do seem to choose putting them on and posting to FC in them quite often), but I doubt you're capable of that.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sammywantsya on May 04, 2012, 02:38:14 pm
i was giving a sympathy towards you and calling it truths but then you have to go on your way to think what you did wasnt wrong ?

dude you know what its not even worth talking to you then if your gonna be that ignorant... i said what i needed to be said.. untill then please ignore me you can x me right there... im done talking to you... what your doing is childs play. this is a GPT SITE not a intelligent forum.. you only posts like religion topics and thats on a GPT site with only one column D+D.... my advice create your own forum....

when i comment things first on a "religion topic" you started to argue with me after.... thats a FACT not some made up story... dude rethink it for a while it will come up your mind.. dont try to act innocent where i didnt intentionally debate the subject when you started it.. untill then tah tah. you blantly called me out where i didnt know who you are in the first place. youve got some nerve to pull a fast one on this where you started this crap...
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 02:48:57 pm
i was giving a sympathy towards you and calling it truths but then you have to go on your way to think what you did wasnt wrong ?

The previous reply was within the context of what you posted, in your own words.  Your subsequent post, (this reply from you), seems to make no reference to that context in that nothing was quoted.  Your "sympathy" is deemed to be condescending and neither required nor, accepted.  The phrase you're garbling is probably 'calling a truce', not "calling it truths", (since you are definitely not 'calling truths').  Remember, I'm not the one who posted a calling-out thread specifically aimed at another FC member; that was you.

dude you know what its not even worth talking to you then if your gonna be that ignorant...

My responses in this context have not demonstrated any 'ignorance'.  This is not the case with your responses, (not only in this particular thread).  Therefore, the evidence of your own ignorance is manifestly apparent.  It is your choice whether or not to post ignorantly.

i said what i needed to be said.. untill then please ignore me you can x me right there... im done talking to you...

Since you'd just recently made those very same claims, (regarding a tacit desire to get the last word in and that you'd be ignoring my future posts - both of which turned out to be false claims, given _this_ posted reply from you), the contention that you lie is substantiated.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sammywantsya on May 04, 2012, 02:54:57 pm
there you go again blowing off your gasket.. its all in the archives you will see it... stop pulling things like you didnt do nothing wrong... your a hard headed guy. as i said before you and your followers can create your own forum its not that hard..

you can call it falsly misused or accused i dont care im not stupid as you think i am... keep argueing about this. its only will make it more bearable to read. i tried to be nice right now but then you keep on making up stories... its really sad that you keep at it on a GPT forum. it is its not amusing to me and others who felt the same way. its just not that amusing anymore..
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: potluck6 on May 04, 2012, 02:58:51 pm
ok wow will take awhile to read all these but am going to so much better than taking a survey on this site  this is fun
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: natashaspy on May 04, 2012, 03:00:10 pm
ok wow will take awhile to read all these but am going to so much better than taking a survey on this site  this is fun

it is rather entertaining...rather like a cat/mouse game... or fusion cash's very own soap opera!  ;)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sammywantsya on May 04, 2012, 03:01:55 pm
ok wow will take awhile to read all these but am going to so much better than taking a survey on this site  this is fun

 i agree it is fun to watch the comments but w.e if this guy thinks he can make me look im a bad person so be it. its only a GPT forum... i really dont care..
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 03:07:19 pm
there you go again blowing off your gasket.. its all in the archives you will see it.

A rational reply was made to your irrational post which did not consist of "blowing off" any "gaskets" is indeed archived and merely a few posts under this one, (whatever that random metaphor was supposed to imply in context).  


... stop pulling things like you didnt do nothing wrong...

Your unsubstantiated, (false), accusations notwithstanding, the ability to censor my posts remains beyond your abilities.  Another tough break?

your a hard headed guy. as i said before you and your followers can create your own forum its not that hard..

Since you still haven't adaquately learned to write/comprehend English after at least 3 years subsequent to immigrating to the U.S., it's likely that your manifest lack of language skills won't be improving anytime soon.  However, you are incorrect regarding the creation of a new "forum"; that can only be done by the FC staff.  Forum participants may only create new subject threads in existing forums, (or, subforums like d+d; the forum in which you are providing evidence to substantiate my previous contentions ... thanks for that, btw).

Lastly, if you are tacitly 'jealous' of someone having 'fans', 'anti-fans', 'groupies', 'anti-groupies', "followers" or 'anti-followers then get your own.  The ones who choose to agree or disagree with my posts, (or anyone else's), do so because they choose to.  Just like you choose to be one of the above.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 03:08:32 pm
it is fun to watch the comments but w.e if this guy thinks he can make me look im a bad person so be it. its only a GPT forum... i really dont care..

You don't need me to make you "look bad", 'sammy'.  You're doing that mainly on your own.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 03:13:42 pm
ok wow will take awhile to read all these but am going to so much better than taking a survey on this site  this is fun

it is rather entertaining...rather like a cat/mouse game... or fusion cash's very own soap opera!  ;)

I prefer to look at it as a contextual example well within the subject of this thread, rather than a 'cat-and-mouse' "game" or, as a *shudder* "soap opera".  Take a step back and consider it from a wider perspective than a 'simple disagreement'; the context of this thread is 'Dumbing-down or wising-up'.  That wasn't intended as some clever play on words; it's the actual question being asked of anyone who chooses to answer it.  Some have chosen to answer in part while others have tacitly chosen to answer by demonstrating the former or the latter.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: sammywantsya on May 04, 2012, 03:15:11 pm
 its not amusing its bearable now and its gettn old. i really dont need to hear a judgemental highly accupied person..peace man its fun for a while


Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 04, 2012, 03:32:05 pm
its not amusing its bearable now and its gettn old.

Does this implicitly constitute a third, (false), claim of yours that you'd be "ignoring" my posts while still posting 'around/concerning' them?
Or, is this merely another 'hit-and-run' rant where you want to rant and then avoid backing up your ranted complaints.  I see.  While this is a cowardly tactic, so is using the "ignore" after whining and retreating.  If you are actually going to ignore my posts, naturally this would include not talking about them/me to others in a passive-aggressive indirect way.

i really dont need to hear a judgemental highly accupied person..peace man its fun for a while

'Oh, another 'hit-and-run' rant where you want to rant and then avoid backing up your ranted complaints.  I see.  While this is a cowardly tactic, so is using the "ignore" after whining and retreating.  If you are actually going to ignore my posts, naturally this would include not talking about them/me to others in a passive-aggressive indirect way.'
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 05, 2012, 07:41:28 am
Ok Sammy, everyone knows you are here. Anyone should be able to see, as you have demonstrated that you are pretty much just FOS and a "look at me" drama Queen. Mission accomplished.

Just a FYI....Sammywantsya doesn't always get what she wants.






OH.....and feel free to not reply to me too.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 05, 2012, 12:36:56 pm
Ok Sammy, everyone knows you are here. Anyone should be able to see, as you have demonstrated that you are pretty much just FOS and a "look at me" drama Queen. Mission accomplished.

Just a FYI....Sammywantsya doesn't always get what she wants.

Maybe she's accustomed to getting a little cheese with her 'whine'.  Doubtless her plot is a source of disappointment for her.

OH.....and feel free to not reply to me too.

I'd like to see whether 'sammy' has sufficient self-control to not reply to someone she's repeatedly stated that she'd ignore, (while continuing to reply to the "ignored" posts).  Expectations are low regarding such an outcome, due entirely to evidence to the contrary.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 06, 2012, 01:18:42 pm
when i comment things first on a "religion topic" you started to argue with me after.... thats a FACT not some made up story...

It's refreshing that you're not making up another story, (such as first class to France on mother's day, etc.), and I agree with the facts regarding the sequence of events.  To emphasize those facts; you _commented first_, (not I), on a religious topic to which I then replied, (that would be after your remarks).  This means that either you're accustomed to having your nonsense go unchallenged or, you always get 'pissy' when it is challenged.

youve got some nerve to pull a fast one on this where you started this crap...

That contradicts what you just stated in this same post and in context; "i comment things first ..." -- 'sammy'. If you're trying to 'pull a slow one' here, that won't work either.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 12, 2012, 11:08:28 pm
After my "rant", I want to say that I really enjoyed reading your conversation here, walksalone11 and falcon9, it was both interesting and informative (or maybe enlightening would be a better word).  

I just had time to briefly rush through latest posts here, didn't get to really read much of them, so I want to be sure to get back on here later this evening. I am looking forward to reading more interesting posts from walksalone11 and bad dog.
Oh OOOPS I mean falcon9....gosh what was I thinking? ( ;D :bootyshake:  ;D 8))

Also comments from the quoted falcon9 post I feel the need to say SOMETHING about ::) .....and also respond to the dumb down wise up question.

No rush ... it's only been nine or ten days, (or so ...).
 :-X  

Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on May 17, 2012, 11:59:52 am
THIS IS A GPT SITE its not meant to be intelligent. some of us arent that smart but when you call someone out and cant leave this alone you go out of your way to berate them including me where i was sensitive about somethings and then stalks me out of the GODs forum and insulted us from there. its get to a point where its gettn annoying and creepy.. i also agree what we calling you out is some what childish too so its both ways for both of us...

i do however have an open mind about your opinions and difference but calling me and idiot hypocryte and a liar ?... how can you call me those things when you yourself dont even know me but when i spoke my mind about religion topics that has no intention to debate you? you started to argue with me then it gets to argueing and picking names at each other like a broken record. i replied back becauuse you mentioned me thats how it got started from there.

 this will be my last post and gonna ignore your future comments from now on seriously. but you have to admit what you did with others are wrong by calling someone names... and i will do the same. i was thinking about this you aint a bad dude but there's a thin line where you have to limit your replies.. like i said before on the other topic we dont hate you you just need to work on that tone... also you gotta remember we have underage kids here as well..

PS if you just wanna post your likes about religion go ahead im not gonna touch it, but where i post somewhere else please dont comment that mentions me because itw as not to debate against you ... DEAL ? lets start over and call it truths i dont like to be named idiot hypocrite and a liar from now on..
No one is "stalking you" or really cares how dumb you are. If you are religious and flaunting it for the world to see expect criticism.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 17, 2012, 12:43:43 pm
THIS IS A GPT SITE its not meant to be intelligent. ... and then stalks me out of the GODs forum ...  

No one is "stalking you" or really cares how dumb you are. If you are religious and flaunting it for the world to see expect criticism.

Exactly.  If religious adherents choose post proselytizing beliefs in public forums, others can choose to post dissenting viewpoints in those same forums, (which are, most emphatically NOT "the g-ds forum"; they are FC forums consisting of d+d, off topic and FC-related topics ... not a one of those are exclusively nor inclusively 'g-d' forums).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: gamerpeeps on May 18, 2012, 03:10:52 pm

LOL! Oh, my, what a discussion! There are so many replies that I could/want to post but I'd be here all day. Let's bring back the "*crickets chirping*" and answer the questions first presented.

...is it actually detrimental to "dumb it down" for others or, wouldn't that be condescending and ultimately not beneficial for everyone?


When you "dumb it down" for others, they wouldn't know it unless they know you or your typical posts so in their perspective it wouldn't be condescending. From your perspective it would be condescending in the manner of speaking from a superior knowledge of the spoken/written language. Where's the benefit?
 
Does "talking over someone's head" inherently 'insult' them or, motivate them to figure out what in the blue blazes they're going on about?

It depends on the individual. Anyone who wishes to improve themselves would be motivated to use the dictionary or ask questions. Others find it insulting because they have a low self esteem, got up on the wrong side of the bed, are just having a bad day or whatever other reason they get insulted for.

As falcon9 has often said..It's a matter of perspective. Speak/post as you would do in normal conversations. If others have a problem with it, then it's their problem. If you really want to get your point across, then maybe you need to paraphrase the comment. The perspective changes with each unique situation.

*crickets chirping*
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 18, 2012, 05:21:21 pm
LOL! Oh, my, what a discussion! There are so many replies that I could/want to post but I'd be here all day. Let's bring back the "*crickets chirping*" and answer the questions first presented.

Either I already agree with you or, you're agreeing with me. *chuckle*  Nevertheless, I wanted to see if anyone dissented or, challenged our parallel points of view.

...is it actually detrimental to "dumb it down" for others or, wouldn't that be condescending and ultimately not beneficial for everyone?


When you "dumb it down" for others, they wouldn't know it unless they know you or your typical posts so in their perspective it wouldn't be condescending. From your perspective it would be condescending in the manner of speaking from a superior knowledge of the spoken/written language. Where's the benefit?
 
Does "talking over someone's head" inherently 'insult' them or, motivate them to figure out what in the blue blazes they're going on about?

It depends on the individual. Anyone who wishes to improve themselves would be motivated to use the dictionary or ask questions. Others find it insulting because they have a low self esteem, got up on the wrong side of the bed, are just having a bad day or whatever other reason they get insulted for.

As falcon9 has often said..It's a matter of perspective. Speak/post as you would do in normal conversations. If others have a problem with it, then it's their problem. If you really want to get your point across, then maybe you need to paraphrase the comment. The perspective changes with each unique situation.

*crickets chirping*
[/quote]
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 20, 2012, 08:23:18 am
Huh?????   
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 20, 2012, 10:31:48 am
Huh?????   

Your selection of the former option in the thread title is duly noted, (the third option is to use the 'ignore' button).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 20, 2012, 01:02:20 pm
But I don't know how to use the ignore button.  I'm too "stoopid."

Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 20, 2012, 01:03:53 pm
Actually, I do know how to use the ignore button.  It's just more fun this way.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 20, 2012, 01:06:26 pm
Actually, I do know how to use the ignore button.  It's just more fun this way.

What's more fun for you; not knowing how to use the simple ignore button function or, simply functioning as a road hazard?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 20, 2012, 01:15:33 pm
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Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 20, 2012, 01:19:44 pm
Chirp  [about 420 times]

Since you've elected to 'spam' this thread by adding nothing, your tacit perrmission to do much the same with any thread you've posted in has been granted, 'troll'.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 20, 2012, 01:40:28 pm
Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp  Chirp
**STOMP!!!**.......**lifts foot and peers under**......**grunts in satisfaction and sits back down**
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 20, 2012, 01:48:50 pm
Chirp  [about 440 times]

**STOMP!!!**.......**lifts foot and peers under**......**grunts in satisfaction and sits back down**

Guess it's just the time of year for 'spam-bugs' to come out a-trolling ... no doubt other xtians fervantly hope that particular one isn't representative of too many of 'em.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: walksalone11 on May 20, 2012, 02:26:02 pm
Chirp  [about 440 times]

**STOMP!!!**.......**lifts foot and peers under**......**grunts in satisfaction and sits back down**

Guess it's just the time of year for 'spam-bugs' to come out a-trolling ... no doubt other xtians fervantly hope that particular one isn't representative of too many of 'em.
Well speaking as a non-Xtian, my experience with most I have came across never said "chirp" but did say something to the effect of "blah" "about 440 times".....
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 20, 2012, 02:36:25 pm
Chirp  [about 440 times]

**STOMP!!!**.......**lifts foot and peers under**......**grunts in satisfaction and sits back down**

Guess it's just the time of year for 'spam-bugs' to come out a-trolling ... no doubt other xtians fervantly hope that particular one isn't representative of too many of 'em.

Well speaking as a non-Xtian, my experience with most I have came across never said "chirp" but did say something to the effect of "blah" "about 440 times".....

Good observation.  When the "chirp" was spammed that many times, it seemed reasonable to deduce that an 'annoying' cricket was being imitated by the spammer - which was possibly unintentially-accurate.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: diala84 on May 30, 2012, 08:56:48 am
In a forum I would say that neither method is best. Speak your mind and if people don't get it either move on or explain it. As for real life you will have to decide. Although I don't always consciously do it, sometimes I will dumb down depending on the situation and the people involved. If everyone around you is less smart about a certain topic it doesn't make sense to go over their heads. However if most of the people in the group understand maybe one or two might have to wise up or ask later to understand. 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 30, 2012, 09:52:50 am
"FORUM RULES

Observe the golden rule
Treat others as you would like to be treated
Respect our advertisers
Do not discuss cancellation or post disparaging remarks
Do not post links to other sites
This means no referral links whatsoever
Do not post your email address or other contact information
Understand that we cannot filter all of the content on the forums, so you may read or see something you don't like.

Do not enter links, your email address, or any other contact information into your profile, title text, or any other location.

Your use of the forums is a privilege, not a right, and we may revoke your access at any time and for any reason.

If you break one of the rules above, you may be subject to disqualification from FusionCash."

I see you guys are still having fun with my post.  I thought it was rather clever, myself.  A couple of observations:  1.  I do not see that the post I made was "spamming" according to the rules of the Forum.  Other posters who have been on longer than I have been called "spamming" the posting of links to other survey sites.  2.  I have not "trolled" this or other websites.  As a matter of fact, if you will check, I have posted to other websites many times and have also posted to this one before the famous "chirp" post.  3.  As I told you before, I am a Christian, not a "fundy" and have not been proselytizing on the Forum.  My only posts of that nature were acknowledging requests for prayer by other Christians.  If this is against the rules, please show it to me and I will cease and desist.  I do not ask you to accept my beliefs; therefore, I feel no need to prove anything to you. 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 30, 2012, 01:44:52 pm
"FORUM RULES:
Understand that we cannot filter all of the content on the forums, so you may read or see something you don't like.

Your use of the forums is a privilege, not a right, and we may revoke your access at any time and for any reason."

These rules for posting apply to all FC members, which would include you, (despite your own misperceptions that follow).
 
I see you guys are still having fun with my post.  I thought it was rather clever, myself. 

On the contrary, nothing further was posted concerning your trolling for the last ten days until you brought it up to re-troll, (after being advised by FC to use the 'ignore button' or lose any legitimate basis for complaint). Trolls sometimes believe that their trollings are "clever" when they are not and xtian trolls believe a number of things which are equally untrue.
 
A couple of observations: I do not see that the post I made was "spamming" according to the rules of the Forum.  I have posted to other websites many times and have also posted to this one before the famous "chirp" post. 

Posting the word "chirp" 420 times in one post neither contributed to the context of the thread, nor asked/answered a question in this thread.  Therefore, it was more of a use of "spamming" in order to troll another FC member.

As I told you before, I am a Christian, not a "fundy" and have not been proselytizing on the Forum. 

"The fundamentalists, also known as fundies or by their Latin classification Homo Phobius, are a subspecies of humanity distinguished by their phobia (simultaneous fear and hatred) of most people who differ from them in any way, based on their extreme religious conviction." -- from the
"Urban Dictionary"

There are numerous archived examples of your proselytizing on FC forums; is it really necessary to produce a cross-section of these as examples when you'd likely continue in denial about your own posts?
(http://i50.tinypic.com/34p0uvo.gif)
 
My only posts of that nature were acknowledging requests for prayer by other Christians.  If this is against the rules, please show it to me and I will cease and desist.

It isn't against FC posting policies to make proselytizing religion, (as with bible-thumping in the 'daily verses' thread you post to).  It also isn't against FC posting policies to challenge the religious claims made in regards to "prayer" or any any other specious religious claims, (despite multiple attempts by some xtians to repress/censor/silence such dissenting viewpoints).

I do not ask you to accept my beliefs; therefore, I feel no need to prove anything to you. 

Such a stance is irrational since you've posted your belief-claims and have the burden of proof to substantiate them when challenged.  Although no one is under an obligation to do so should they "feel no need to prove anything", that merely indicates a preference for making unfounded assertions followed by a refusal to be responsible for backing them up.  Colloquially, that's known as "hit-and-run" posting wherein the one making an unfounded assertion designates their post as an "opinion" which requires no substantiation.  Therefore, unsubstantiated beliefs are reduced to being opinions without evidentiary basis.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 30, 2012, 03:49:59 pm
This is the sum total of all my posts about my faith.  I challenge you to find something that looks like proselytizing (1: to induce someone to convert to one's faith
2: to recruit someone to join one's party, institution, or cause: to recruit or convert especially to a new faith, institution, or cause).  I am not trying to recruit or convert anyone.

This Christian does not hate Atheists either.  Neither do most people I know, Christians and non-Christians alike.  True Christianity is love and God is Love.
 To the original poster - have you studied Calvinism?  Its origins and its originators?  And what makes you think the Calvinists are correct?  I have noticed in my 68 years that most people who advance theories as yours have not studied and do not know what they are talking about.  The theories are an excuse to convince themselves there is no God.  And most people who do this are trying to combat the teachings of hard-line preachers and evangelists who don't know what they are talking about either, but who are mostly in the field of religion for the money.  Those people have done more to hurt the people who they say they are trying to help.  If you get down to studying the Bible, you will find it is really simple and you don't have to believe outrageous theories.
 God doesn't "hate fags."  He hates the sin, but loves the sinner.
I agree that the two are compatible.  You do not have to make a choice.  A thinking person can have faith and still study science.  However, with the number of times that scientists have changed their minds about one thing and another, one wonders why some people choose to believe everything they are told about science.  I believe a higher power has given us the capability to learn and do all sorts of things.
Yes, I fully expect to see my brother again in Heaven someday with other members of my family who were believers.  My mother was a wonderful Christian woman who prayed for her children every day.  I truly believe that my brother was given extra time here on earth (his doctors called him a miracle man because he survived more than six years with lung cancer after being given three months to live) for him to return to God and to become closer to his family.  There were so many people praying for him.   So we were grateful for the time that we had.  Thanks again for all the prayers and good wishes.  I am truly grateful.
I appreciate more than words can say the expressions of sympathy and hope.  I grieve for my brother, and I know that I will always miss him.  I still miss my mother and grandmother that I was close to and lost many years ago.  But I believe when my brother died he had a family reunion in Heaven with them and other family members.  I grieve for him, but I rejoice that he is no longer in pain.  The feeling that I cannot really believe he is gone is still with me.  Right now I am visiting my daughter and son-in-law and my three-year-old grandson.  I think it is good for me to be around my grandson and watch the new and exciting things he is experiencing every day.  And to those who believe in the power of prayer, please say one for me.  Thanks so much.
My favorite Bible verse is "The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want."
I have come to the conclusion that there is little to be gained by debating religion or politics, especially on a forum such as this.  I must admit I have been tempted and have a couple of times commented on these two subjects.  However, the debates usually end up with people on both sides getting mad and calling each other names, etc.  What is the point in that?  I believe most of the people who respond have deep feelings about the subjects (or they just want to get other people upset and incited to becoming combative), so it is unlikely anyone will be persuaded to change their minds.  I myself am a Christian and hope that people would respect my faith as I respect theirs. 
Yesterday, an eight-year-old autistic boy was found after six days of being lost in a Civil War battlefield park in Hanover County, VA, where I used to live and near where I now live.  He had wandered away in the woods while on an outing with his family.  Over 6,000 people from all over the country searched for him.  Yesterday, they found him alive and in good shape; he only had some cuts and bruises and was dehydrated.  In announcing the finding of little Robert, the Hanover County Sheriff, with tears in his eyes, said, "There is a God and God does answer prayers."  (Please, I'm not asking for a religious debate, just celebrating the finding of this little boy.)
I looked at this discussion shortly after it began - waaaay back when.  Then I looked at it a few days ago when I realized it was still going.  That is when I made a comment.  I don't mind if people call me names (although I thought that was not allowed on the forum).  However, it is interesting to me how vitriolic people can be when it comes to this subject.  It makes me wonder why people expend so much energy on a subject when neither side is likely to be swayed.  And, after all, you are entitled to your own opinions, as am I.  I also wonder how many people have done any in-depth studies on the subject - and I mean higher education, not just the Internet.  Have you really studied ancient Greek and Latin to find out how the languages have developed to the modern day, and thus many of the customs?  Have you studied archeology?  More and more of the modern archeologists have said that their work is proving that Biblical narratives and locations are more accurate than many people have believed.  Have you studied ancient history up to the modern day to see how countries and customs have evolved?  There is so much more involved than just taking a theory that someone has put forth and repeating it as fact.  Many years ago when I was a teenager I had many questions about the Bible and how certain things and events could have really been possible.  I have learned much since then after studying in college and doing personal research.  When you know how ancient writers wrote and how the Bible has been translated again and again, you realize that, although much of it is written in the symbolism of the day, the core of the message is always the same.  I am not a literalist; I have a brain.  I hope you guys can find something more constructive to do than throwing slurs and calling people names and passing judgement on people you don't even know.  There are so many better ways to spend your energies - like helping the less fortunate.
BTW, how many of those people on here who do not believe in God celebrated Christmas?  Just wondered.
I am also praying for you and your family.  I believe God hears and answers prayers.
One more comment from me and I am out of this never-ending debate (??).  The comment you posted regarding my assertion that I am not a fundamentalist is made with an assumption that you know what goes on in my head.  I have gone through this entire thread and other topics to which I have posted to see if I have posted anything that seems to show extremism on my part.  There is no "strict adherence to specific theological doctrines, combined with a vigorous attack on outside threats to their religious beliefs."  I am a Christian, not a fundamentalist - there is a difference.  I have made no "vigorous" attack on outside threats to my religious beliefs.  I believe that anyone can believe whatever they want to believe; my words are not going to change them.  Most of my posts on this thread were an attempt to show that your "vigorous attacks" seem to indicate some sort of psychological problem.  I am not a psychologist, but there seems to be something lacking in your life that causes you to interminably attack anyone who disagrees with you, especially on one particular subject. 
Thank you all for the prayers for my sister.  She is doing well in her recovery so far.
I realize these so-called discussion boards are "enter at your own risk," but is it necessary to comment with your views (to which you are entitled) on a post from someone who has lost a loved one and is, by their own choice, asking for prayers?  Everyone knows by this time that you are challenging Christians (xtians) to provide tangible and irrefutable proof that the Christian God does not exist.  Personally, I feel no need to try and prove anything.  My reaction and my view of your post is that it is at the least ungentlemanly and at the most extremely distasteful.


Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 30, 2012, 04:02:17 pm
To Walksalone:  "Crickets throughout history have had all kinds of old wives tales and superstitions surround them. Some of the most popular include:

-If you find a cricket on your hearth, it is a sign of good luck for your entire household for thousands of years to come.
-If a cricket suddenly stops chirping, danger is close by.
-Crickets bring good luck to the entire family if they enter your home.
-Images of crickets on necklaces, bracelets, or paintings can ward off the evil eye.
-Killing a cricket, even if you killed it by accident is very very bad luck, so you had better not use them for fishing.
-The chirping of a cricket brings good luck to all that hear. "  Yahoo Answers

Personally, I, myself, don't believe in old wives tales and superstitions.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 30, 2012, 04:16:54 pm
Crickets throughout history have had all kinds of old wives tales and superstitions surround them.

Personally, I, myself, don't believe in old wives tales and superstitions.

The assertion concerning superstitions and not believing in them is manifestly untrue since you've self-declared as a xtian.

"Religion is based ... mainly upon fear ... fear of the mysterious, fear of defeat, fear of death. Fear is the
parent of cruelty, and therefore it is no wonder if cruelty and religion have gone hand in hand . . . . My own view
on religion is that of Lucretius. I regard it as a disease born of fear and as a source of untold misery to the
human race."
-- Bertrand Russell
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 30, 2012, 05:25:01 pm
This is the sum total of all my posts about my faith.  I challenge you to find something that looks like proselytizing: to induce someone to convert to one's faith ...

Okay.

"True Christianity is love and God is Love."

The above remark you confirmed posting is religious propaganda and as such, is proselytizing xtianity.

"The theories are an excuse to convince themselves there is no God."

Characterizing challenges to xtians to provide evidence of their claims asserting that 'there is a g-d' as "excuses" in response to an irrational demand that a negative premise be 'proven', (e.g., that there 'isn't a g-d'), consitutes both a logical fallacy and an implicit proselytizing of an inherent premise that there is such a supernatural being.

"If you get down to studying the Bible, you will find it is really simple and you don't have to believe outrageous theories."

That is a false assertion since one who 'studies the bible' is required to have "faith" to believe the "outrageous theories" presented in that dubious collection of documents.  That requirement/admonishment contained within "the bible" is inherently proselytizing as is the recommendation to study that dubious collection of documents.

"I believe a higher power has given us the capability to learn and do all sorts of things.
Yes, I fully expect to see my brother again in Heaven someday with other members of my family who were believers.  My mother was a wonderful Christian woman who prayed for her children every day. But I believe when my brother died he had a family reunion in Heaven with them and other family members."

The public, (FC forums), expression of such beliefs constitutes proselytizing those beliefs, (e.g., play upon any fears of the deaths of loved ones or, one's own demise, in order to implicitly proselytize xtian beliefs).   

My favorite Bible verse is "The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want."

Requoting an existing collection of dubious religious documents, (when there are already millions of copies extant), is using such to proselytize.

"I myself am a Christian and hope that people would respect my faith as I respect theirs."

That remark contains an inherent falsehood, ("respect" for non-xtian viewpoints which is entirely lacking - as shown by other archived FC posts made by the claimant).  It comprises proselytizing because it implicitly implies that a xtian respects other 'faiths', (even when a non-religious point of view doesn't rely upon "faith"), and seeks to convince the reader that such a false assertion is something to be aspired to via becoming a xtian - as if some non-xtians do not respect the 'faiths' of others, (unsurprisingly, some do - who'd have thought it so?).

"... the Hanover County Sheriff, with tears in his eyes, said, "There is a God and God does answer prayers." 

Relating a story concerning someone else making a false attribution of a result to a hypothetical supernatural being is definitely proselytizing.
 
"More and more of the modern archeologists have said that their work is proving that Biblical narratives and locations are more accurate than many people have believed.  Have you studied ancient history up to the modern day to see how countries and customs have evolved?  There is so much more involved than just taking a theory that someone has put forth and repeating it as fact."

As someone who has studied ancient histories extensively, I'd have to agree that "there is so much more involved than just taking a theory that someone has put forth", (such as the religious speculative theories in 'the bible'), and repeating it as fact."  Putting forth unreferenced and thoeries and sophist speculations by religiously-biased "modern archeologists" constitutes an especially insidious proselytizing.

"I am also praying for you and your family.  I believe God hears and answers prayers."

Such religious beliefs constitute proselytizing.  We therefore have evidence which you presented, in your own archived words, that contradicts your claim to not proselytizing, (and 'not' doing it nine times).  What such evidence contrary to your claim inherently demonstrates is that such self-delusions are often part and parcel of blind faith.

One more comment from me and I am out of this never-ending debate (??).  The comment you posted regarding my assertion that I am not a fundamentalist is made with an assumption that you know what goes on in my head. 

On the contrary, that conclusion was reached based solely upon your publically-made posts in that regard, (not upon whatever irrationalities may be going on in you head at any given time).

I have gone through this entire thread and other topics to which I have posted to see if I have posted anything that seems to show extremism on my part.  There is no "strict adherence to specific theological doctrines, combined with a vigorous attack on outside threats to their religious beliefs." 

There aren't?  Then you may consider that 'elves/gnomes/pixies/sprites/angels/daemons' may have accessed your computer and used it to publically post such remarks under your 'nym.
 
I am a Christian, not a fundamentalist - there is a difference.  I have made no "vigorous" attack on outside threats to my religious beliefs. 

Your assertion is contradicted by your other posts which belie that assertion.  It's unclear why such an insistant denial of archived evidence is being repeated, (as if a falsehood oft-repeated can become the 'truth'?).  Since you've previously declared that you have no responsibility under the burden of proof to support your claims with evidence, it will be left to interested others to choose whether or not they are prompted to provide such evidence, (in the form of your own posted words), which contradicts your empty declarations.

Most of my posts on this thread were an attempt to show that your "vigorous attacks" indicate some sort of psychological problem.   

Challenging the specious claims of religious adherents co not constitute the "vigorous attacks", (presumably implying 'fundamentalism on my part); which would "indicate some sort of psychological problem."  Using 'pop-psychology' as an ad hominem, (name-calling), is a particularly weak form of arguement.  Since you raised the matter of "some sort of psychological problem", it has been theorized by trained psychologists that those who cling irrationally to religious "faith", (that is, to that which has no basis in valid evidence and instead relies entirely upon blind belief), may have seriously debilitating psychological impairments.  Those particular impairments do not apply to those who hold no such irrational beliefs/faith and instead, manifest rationality and logical reasoning.

I am not a psychologist, but there seems to be something lacking in your life that causes you to interminably attack anyone who disagrees with you, especially on one particular subject.

That's another of your false characterizations; challenging an initial dubious assertion made by anyone, (including religious adherents), does not constitute an "attack" - either "interminably" or intermittently.  Conversely, the "vigorous attacks" made by several xtians in response to such challenges to "anyone who disagrees with" their particular religious superstitions in clearly evident on these forums.


I realize these so-called discussion boards are "enter at your own risk," but is it necessary to comment with your views (to which you are entitled) on a post from someone who has lost a loved one and is, by their own choice, asking for prayers?  Everyone knows by this time that you are challenging Christians (xtians) to provide tangible and irrefutable proof that the Christian God does not exist.

No, I've consistently challenged those xtians who make specious religious claims to provide evidence to support them, (which does not include requests for "proof that the Christian God does not exist"; the request has always been for evidence that 'g-d' does exist).
Sans any irrefutable evidence being presented as proof of the claimed existence of a supernatural entity, the only logical conclusion which can be drawn is that such religious adherents have "faith" that such an entity exists which circularly relies upon their "belief" in same.

Personally, I feel no need to try and prove anything. 

While I'm already aware of the dodging of responsibility under the burden of proof for making specious claims, it's good that others can read your own words and discern for themselves whether such comprises blind-faith, sans evidence. 

My reaction and my view of your post is that it is at the least ungentlemanly and at the most extremely distasteful.

Coincidentally, my view regarding your posts is that they've consisted of disingenuous proselytizing which I find extremely distasteful as well.

"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their
own desires."
-- Susan B. Anthony

"I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular
superstition (Christianity) one 'redeeming' feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology."
-- Thomas Jefferson
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on May 30, 2012, 06:11:44 pm
   
The Jefferson Presidential Library has searched for the following alleged quotation and cannot find it within their collection of known and verified Jefferson writings. Therefore we think this quotation is probably a forgery and recommend its removal from all quotes collections.
     -- Positive Atheism Magazine

"Quotation 'Not Found'
The Christian god can easily be pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites.
-- Quotation 'Not Found,' popularly alleged to have been in a letter to his nephew, Peter Carr. Our editor, Cliff Walker, checked "by hand" every letter to Peter Carr included in the Multomah County Library's reader copy of Jefferson's Works and found nothing along these lines in any such letter.

Letter Not Found
I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular superstition one redeeming feature. They are all alike, founded upon fables and mythologies.
-- Quotation 'Not Found,' while Remsburg did have access to sources that have since been lost, and while this sounds like other statements Jefferson is kown to have made, we feel safer keeping this one out of our collection unless and until the letter in question surfaces and is verified to be from the President's hand."
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 30, 2012, 06:23:15 pm
"Quotation 'Not Found'
"Personally, I feel no need to try and prove anything."

Fixating upon an quotation at the end of a lengthy refutation of your specious claims may seem like a 'clever dodge' to you however, it instead illuminates an apparently inherent disingenuity in one particular xtian engaging in it, (in lieu of taking responsibility for substantiating their specious claims).

As for Jefferson's quote; a brief search brings up ten pages of results attributing the quote to T. Jefferson. Several of these sources cannot verify the attribution; just as there are NO verifiable sources for biblical quotations.

"The fact that a believer is (possibly) happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact than a drunken
man is happier than a sober one."
-- George Bernard Shaw
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: jcribb16 on May 30, 2012, 08:20:33 pm
    pros·e·ly·tized   pros·e·ly·tiz·ing
Definition of PROSELYTIZE
intransitive verb
1
: to induce someone to convert to one's faith
2
: to recruit someone to join one's party, institution, or cause

transitive verb
: to recruit or convert especially to a new faith, institution, or cause

(Merriam-Webster Dictionary)

Actually, since it is insisted that proselytizing is going on in the Bible verse thread, I believe, then that proselytizing is happening from you, too, in order to sway people from discussing religious issues and instead, agree with the stance that there is no God; a *"cause."  You are consistently knocking just about any religious post in this forum.  This type of proselytizing for that kind of cause is distasteful (using your word.)

Most Christians in here do accept anyone else's choice of what they believe or don't believe.  It is, ultimately, everyone's personal choice to believe what they think.  However, you do not show the same courtesy with anyone else's choice of Christianity, and continue to try and disregard their beliefs totally, disprove them, and make them look foolish and irrational.  This is NOT following the Golden Rule listed in this thread.  *Disparaging and uncomplimentary remarks consistently are being made from you to others with regard to religion.  There is no debating going on - it's completely one-sided with all rebuttal dismissive with the impression you are totally correct and the religious side are totally incorrect.  Once again, this is not following the Golden Rule, and is very disparaging and offensive.

*Cause - 1. To be the cause of or reason for; result in.
2. To bring about or compel by authority or force: The moderator invoked a rule causing the debate to be ended.   1.(Verb) - Give rise to; cause to happen or occur, not always intentionally; "cause a commotion"; "make a stir"; "cause an accident" (The Free Dictionary) 

*Disparaging - Adj.   1. Expressive of low opinion; "derogatory comments"; "disparaging remarks about the new house"
derogative, derogatory
uncomplimentary - tending to (or intended to) detract or disparage     


When I first joined, there were a lot of religious/non-religious debates in this forum.  While we all may not have agreed, and sparked, and sometimes felt like pulling hairs out, there was still room for listening, respecting and discussing the disagreements.  Later, things did get a little heated, and several had to back off for awhile and cool off.  I look back on many of those, now, and would much rather have those debates with those posters back in place again.  At least there was discussion most of the time, and we could still interject humor from both sides at the end of the day. 

Religious debates are dropping in number now and while you might be ecstatic about that, as it seems, others enjoy earning a bonus in here for posting things of interest, which do include Bible verses for inspiration, and asking for prayers and acknowledging prayers answered.  You have taken a lot of that joy away from many because you come in constantly doing what was said above.

Yes, the ignore button can be used.  However, that does not solve the issue, especially when newbies come in and get treated the same way.  They come in innocently and then are at a loss at how to respond to you.  It's just stirring up strife.  A little respect can go a long way.  Yes, it's an open forum, but it's not a forum for people to come into and feel belittled for their stance on things.  The open forum doesn't necessarily mean that you have to go into everyone of the threads, especially the religious ones, simply to make your disparaging remarks.

The report button is there for a reason.  However, apparently people are afraid to use it now for fear of reprimand on them for using it when a poster is breaking or appears to be breaking 1 or 2 of the rules.  There needs to be fairness represented by all posters of this forum, in order to make it a great forum, and a forum that members of FC enjoy coming into each day to post posts. 


Anyway, with all of that said, have a great evening and a better Thursday.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: jcribb16 on May 30, 2012, 08:24:19 pm
"FORUM RULES

Observe the golden rule
Treat others as you would like to be treated
Respect our advertisers
Do not discuss cancellation or post disparaging remarks
Do not post links to other sites
This means no referral links whatsoever
Do not post your email address or other contact information
Understand that we cannot filter all of the content on the forums, so you may read or see something you don't like.

Do not enter links, your email address, or any other contact information into your profile, title text, or any other location.

Your use of the forums is a privilege, not a right, and we may revoke your access at any time and for any reason.

If you break one of the rules above, you may be subject to disqualification from FusionCash."

I see you guys are still having fun with my post.  I thought it was rather clever, myself.  A couple of observations:  1.  I do not see that the post I made was "spamming" according to the rules of the Forum.  Other posters who have been on longer than I have been called "spamming" the posting of links to other survey sites.  2.  I have not "trolled" this or other websites.  As a matter of fact, if you will check, I have posted to other websites many times and have also posted to this one before the famous "chirp" post.  3.  As I told you before, I am a Christian, not a "fundy" and have not been proselytizing on the Forum.  My only posts of that nature were acknowledging requests for prayer by other Christians.  If this is against the rules, please show it to me and I will cease and desist.  I do not ask you to accept my beliefs; therefore, I feel no need to prove anything to you. 
Thank you for posting those rules for all of us to see again.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 30, 2012, 10:49:41 pm
Definition of PROSELYTIZE

Yes thank you, I'm well aware of what the word means and have used it in context of noting the examples provided as proselytizing.  Conversely, there appear to be some xtian proselytizers who remain unaware of how the description fits the content of some of their posts, (and then try to force-fit that description to my responses to those proselytizing posts with some inane 'I-know-you-are-but-what-am-I' nonsense).

Actually, since it is insisted that proselytizing is going on in the Bible verse thread, I believe, then that proselytizing is happening from you, too, in order to sway people from discussing religious issues and instead, agree with the stance that there is no God; a *"cause."

No; challenging specious religious claims does not constitute "proselytizing" - that is a misapplication of the definition and a false characterization of what's taken place, (plus, the actual exchanges are archived so, your misrepresenting them is disingenuous). My challenges to specious claims are not made "in order to sway people from discussing religious issues" since there was at least some expectation that such challenges would be met, (and some at least tried).  The "stance" which I've always taken is that the burden of proof/substantiating a claim remains with the claimant, (that would be those religious adherents who've claimed that 'g-d' exists, sans evidence to support their claim), and haven't made a direct claim "that there is no g-d".  Therefore, you're misrepresenting challenges to xtian claims as making an opposite claim.  There is no "cause" being proselytized by challenging specious claims ... I challenge several types of claims, religious or secular.

You are consistently knocking just about any religious post in this forum.  This type of proselytizing for that kind of cause is distasteful (using your word.)

Characterizing dissenting viewpoints as "knocking" is a subjectively-biased opinion.  As an "opinion", it is a subjective interpretation and not objective evidence to support such prejudicial descriptors.  To reiterate that point; challenging specious religious claims does not constitute
"proselytizing" - that is a misapplication of the definition and a false characterization of what's taken place.  Lastly, the use of the word
"distasteful" was a quote from the other trolling xtian in this thread which was my subjective opinion of her, (and your), religious proselytizing posts. It is suspected that the cause of both of you xtians finding such challenges to your specious beliefs/faith to be "distasteful" lies within the blind-faith paradigm and a reluctance to question such religious convictions.  I don't have such a reluctance and if you're 'free' to post such religious proselytizings on open forums, so too am I free to oppose them, (whether your characterization of such dissent is viewed as "distasteful" as I view your religious proselytizing or not; you can no silence/censor/inhibit/restrict an opposing viewpoint than I can yours).

Most Christians in here do accept anyone else's choice of what they believe or don't believe.

Those statistics are unavailable for verification of your claim however, there have been/are at least half a dozen xtians who have posted in direct contradiction to such a claim, (e.g., they do not "accept" non-xtian viewpoints, (as opposed to 'beliefs'), and have tried various ad hominems, diversionary tactics, trolling/calling-out, dodging rebuttals and engaging in dissembling in lieu of actually 'accepting', (beyond any empty and contradictory assertions made that they do).

It is, ultimately, everyone's personal choice to believe what they think.

Indeed it is; which includes a personal choice to consider specious religious beliefs to be irrational/dangerous and to oppose them.  Otherwise, that other "personal choice" mentioned becomes a biased one-way street, applying only to religious adherents and not to non-religious dissention.  

However, you do not show the same courtesy with anyone else's choice of Christianity, and continue to try and disregard their beliefs totally, disprove them, and make them look foolish and irrational.  

Since the "same courtesy" is apparently not being applied by several xtians to non-xtian dissent, it is unreasonable to expect such a "courtesy" to be exclusively-applied.

This is NOT following the Golden Rule listed in this thread.

That is a misapplication of the "Golden Rule" listed under FC posting policies since proselytizing religous adherents had/have Initiated such threads and posts, (which tacitly imply that, since I choose not to be proselytized to/treated that way, those religious adherents doing so are the ffirst to violate that "Golden Rule").  Several of those religious proselytizers have then gone on to "NO flaming, NO derogatory remarks to other members" portion of the rule when any burden of proof challenge arises.  Many of those same religious adherents have then falsely characterized such challenges as making "derrogatory remarks", (but have been unable to provide quoted evidence in context to substantiate that such remarks as they perceive to be "derrogatory" have been in reply to previous derrogatory remarks made by those same religious adherents.  Unremarkably, several of those adherents had proceeded to "report" only 'one-sided' versions to the moderator - omitting the portion where they initiated the "flames" in violation of FC's posting policies.

There is no debating going on - it's completely one-sided with all rebuttal dismissive with the impression you are totally correct and the religious side are totally incorrect.

Well, 'that' particular characterization happens to be incorrect since there has been very little actual "debate" coming from the religious adherent side of the matter.  In that regard, it has been somewhat "one-sided" with most of the religious adherents appearing to be content with making specious/unreasooned pronouncements/declarations, (sans substantiations), and then disparaging dissenting/reasoned rebuttals.  Since I've never asserted that I'm "totally correct and the religious side are totally incorrect", that would be another specious declaration lacking evidence, (as in, a quoted post of mine asserting such a thing ... a random subjective 'interpretation' doesn't constitute such evidence - it must be a direct quote).

Religious debates are dropping in number now and while you might be ecstatic about that, as it seems ...

That's one of those 'subjective interpretations' previously mentioned.  Although I haven't read many of the archived threads in the context of religious debates, I have read those I've participated in and either there were more then than now or, that's another specious claim, (since it's relatively moot, it isn't worth the time & effort to me to go back and verify your assertion).

Yes, the ignore button can be used.  However, that does not solve the issue, especially when newbies come in and get treated the same way.

On the contrary, having once been a newbie here myself, (as were all of us), I've endeavored to treat the majority with more patience than with the more senior members.  If some newbie first jumps right into the fray with some especially strident religious proselytizing, I've occasionally, (as in, not every time), challenged it, (as in, challenging what they've asserted, not the newbie 'themselves' ).

Yes, it's an open forum, but it's not a forum for people to come into and feel belittled for their stance on things.  The open forum doesn't necessarily mean that you have to go into everyone of the threads, especially the religious ones, simply to make your disparaging remarks.

First, the FC forums are open to any FC member who chooses to post on extant threads.  Such threads are not the exclusive property of those participating in them, nor some sort of 'free pass' to blurt out anything and expect no dissenting viewpoints in reply.  To reiterate that point once again; characterizing dissenting viewpoints as "disparaging remarks" is an inherently personal and biased opinion.  It disregards my personal & biased opinion that proselytizing posts made by religious adherents comprise "disparaging remarks" which eschew reason.

The report button is there for a reason.  However, apparently people are afraid to use it now for fear of reprimand on them for using it when a poster is breaking or appears to be breaking 1 or 2 of the rules.  

If any are "afraid" of using the "report button" it's likely because they've been previously chastised for misusing it to make false reports, (and have been warned to discontinue such practices of "telling on" other members by submitted false accusations).  On the other hand, my posts have been trolled, religious adherents have posted threads specifically to "call out" another FC member, (me), and been intially-"flamed" and the ones doing so were warned by the moderator that those Are violations of FC posting policies.  Yet, you and they remain on FC, presumably 'surprised' that you've not been banned as the rules state, ("What if I break this rule? You will be banned for a minimum of 14 days and in a severe case your FusionCash account will be closed and all money will be forfeited").  This just goes to show that FC is even-handed in considering the situation.

"Satan hasn't a single salaried helper; the Opposition employ a million."
-- Mark Twain <-- satirical humor
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: jcribb16 on May 31, 2012, 03:12:53 pm
You say "yet, I haven't been banned and remain on FC?"  Where do you get off saying that about me?  How would you know something like that in the first place?  I have not been banned and not even been threatened of being banned.  I've only been "scolded" once, and that same scold was directed to you, as well.  Are you involved in the "inside" of the workings of FC to be allowed to make a comment such as you made?  To me, that is breaking/close to breaking the 4th rule of "Do not discuss cancellation or post disparaging remarks.  It's as if you seem to "know" that perhaps I could have been banned from FC, and if that is so, that is disparaging to comment on something like that about anyone in here.  And to make something clear here, I have never initiated a thread to "call" you out.

QUOTE from Falcon9:Posted on: May 30, 2012, 10:49:41 pm
Posted by: falcon9

"If any are "afraid" of using the "report button" it's likely because they've been previously chastised for misusing it to make false reports, (and have been warned to discontinue such practices of "telling on" other members by submitted false accusations).  On the other hand, my posts have been trolled, religious adherents have posted threads specifically to "call out" another FC member, (me), and been intially-"flamed" and the ones doing so were warned by the moderator that those Are violations of FC posting policies.  Yet, you and they remain on FC, presumably 'surprised' that you've not been banned as the rules state, ("What if I break this rule? You will be banned for a minimum of 14 days and in a severe case your FusionCash account will be closed and all money will be forfeited").  This just goes to show that FC is even-handed in considering the situation."
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 31, 2012, 03:58:44 pm
You say "yet, I haven't been banned and remain on FC?"  Where do you get off saying that about me?  

It was a simple statement of fact; you're still on the FC forums and able to post, therefore you haven't been banned.  Reading anything else into a simple factual statement may be considered to be both irrational and a bit paranoid.

- [this reply has been 'dumbed-down' in accordance with the context of this thread] -

"If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart
just in time to ask questions?"
--Scott Adams
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: jcribb16 on May 31, 2012, 04:44:39 pm
You say "yet, I haven't been banned and remain on FC?"  Where do you get off saying that about me?  

It was a simple statement of fact; you're still on the FC forums and able to post, therefore you haven't been banned.  Reading anything else into a simple factual statement may be considered to be both irrational and a bit paranoid.

- [this reply has been 'dumbed-down' in accordance with the context of this thread] -

"If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart
just in time to ask questions?"
--Scott Adams


Ha ha hee hee  - You are too funny!
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on May 31, 2012, 05:03:37 pm
You say "yet, I haven't been banned and remain on FC?"  Where do you get off saying that about me?  

It was a simple statement of fact; you're still on the FC forums and able to post, therefore you haven't been banned.  Reading anything else into a simple factual statement may be considered to be both irrational and a bit paranoid.

- [this reply has been 'dumbed-down' in accordance with the context of this thread] -

"If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart
just in time to ask questions?"
--Scott Adams

Ha ha hee hee  - You are too funny!

That depends upon whether or not sarcasm is being attempted in response to 'sarchasm', ("the gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the recipient who doesn't get it").
(http://i50.tinypic.com/34p0uvo.gif)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on June 03, 2012, 08:53:43 pm
You know, Falcon9, one day last week I actually hit the ignore button for you, but I had to unblock you.  Your posts are so hilarious!!

"I would rather live my live as if there were life after death, and later on find out there really isn't, than  to live my life as if is NO life after death, and later find out there really IS."
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 03, 2012, 11:57:07 pm
You know, Falcon9, one day last week I actually hit the ignore button for you, but I had to unblock you.  Your posts are so hilarious!!

Something is unclear about that ... if the ignore button was used to block my posts from your eyes, how would you know if such posts were hilarious or not?


"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."
-- Steven Weinberg, quoted in The New York Times, April 20, 1999
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on June 04, 2012, 08:35:13 am
Oh, I had read many of your posts before that.  I just missed you and getting my laugh for the day.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 04, 2012, 01:17:38 pm
Oh, I had read many of your posts before that.  I just missed you and getting my laugh for the day.

Okay, given our diametrically-opposed stances, that's as clear as muddy water then.


"An atheist doesn't have to be someone who thinks he has a proof that there can't be a g-d. He only has to be someone who believes that the evidence on the g-d question is at a similar level to the evidence on the werewolf question."
-- John McCarthy
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on June 04, 2012, 05:04:55 pm
Given our clearly diametrically opposed views, it still doesn't mean I can't find you funny. 
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 04, 2012, 05:12:16 pm
Given our clearly diametrically opposed views, it still doesn't mean I can't find you funny.  

That can happen, true.  There's a friend of my gf's who is staunchly catholic and yet, finds George Carlin's irreligious humor to be extremely funny, (and occasionally mine too).  I'm not sure that parallel applies, (irreligious humor-wise), however her friend did laugh aloud after she'd sneezed and I remarked, "may any hypothetical deities potentially extant bestow hypothetical intercession upon you."  My gf then rhetorically commented to her, "he's constitutionally unable to say 'bless you'".  Instead of going into the origin of that phrase, we all laughed at that point.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: loulizlee on June 04, 2012, 07:31:10 pm
I don't know how old you are, so I don't know if you remember a comedian who called himself Brother Dave Gardner.  Now Brother Dave's comedy was irreverent, but I still have about three of his vinyl discs.  He was so funny!!!  BTW, how many hours a day does your GF study the dictionary?
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 05, 2012, 12:08:56 am
I don't know how old you are, so I don't know if you remember a comedian who called himself Brother Dave Gardner.  Now Brother Dave's comedy was irreverent, but I still have about three of his vinyl discs.  He was so funny!!!
Quote

Nope, never heard of him.

BTW, how many hours a day does your GF study the dictionary?

None.  She seems to consider me as her 'walking, talking dictionary' however, I've never had to dumb anything down for her before.


"If you don't want to hear the answer, don't ask the question."
-- anon
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on June 05, 2012, 01:44:55 am
BTW, how many hours a day does your GF study the dictionary?

None.  She seems to consider me as her 'walking, talking dictionary' however, I've never had to dumb anything down for her before. 

Unless, of course, you want to include the hours she spends studying it, contemplating if it's big enough to THROW at you and get her point across.....
 :o ;D
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 05, 2012, 01:57:09 am
BTW, how many hours a day does your GF study the dictionary?

None.  She seems to consider me as her 'walking, talking dictionary' however, I've never had to dumb anything down for her before. 

Unless, of course, you want to include the hours she spends studying it, contemplating if it's big enough to THROW at you and get her point across.....
 :o ;D

Would that be similar to Monty Python's sketch on "How To Put Your Budgie Down"?

"Well, I've just been reading a big book about how to put your budgie down. It seems you can either hit them with the book or shoot them there, just above the beak."
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: duroz on June 05, 2012, 03:55:36 am
BTW, how many hours a day does your GF study the dictionary?

None.  She seems to consider me as her 'walking, talking dictionary' however, I've never had to dumb anything down for her before. 

Unless, of course, you want to include the hours she spends studying it, contemplating if it's big enough to THROW at you and get her point across.....
 :o ;D

Would that be similar to Monty Python's sketch on "How To Put Your Budgie Down"?

"Well, I've just been reading a big book about how to put your budgie down. It seems you can either hit them with the book or shoot them there, just above the beak."

                                (http://i.imgur.com/OW11N.jpg)

(I like the Dead Parrot Sketch too)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 05, 2012, 04:13:39 am
(I like the Dead Parrot Sketch too)

That's the one ... also, my friends and I used to annoy people by recreating the Dead Parrot sketch, (with the Brit accents), in its entirety.  We were teenagers; that was our function.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on June 05, 2012, 04:40:26 am
(I like the Dead Parrot Sketch too)

That's the one ... also, my friends and I used to annoy people by recreating the Dead Parrot sketch, (with the Brit accents), in its entirety.  We were teenagers; that was our function.
Well this has nothing what-so-ever to do with anything being said lol BUT I am completely hung up on this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc)
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 05, 2012, 04:51:35 am
Well this has nothing what-so-ever to do with anything being said lol BUT I am completely hung up on this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc)

 :o

Subject-drift occurred however, thank you for bringing it back to the context of the thread title, (your video reminds me why I'm against proselytizing as well; it tends to promote dumbing-down).
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: Cuppycake on June 05, 2012, 06:46:43 am
Well this has nothing what-so-ever to do with anything being said lol BUT I am completely hung up on this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc)

 :o

Subject-drift occurred however, thank you for bringing it back to the context of the thread title, (your video reminds me why I'm against proselytizing as well; it tends to promote dumbing-down).

Well glad I could help lol ! Surely you will admit that Zombies + Sign Language is a pretty bad *bleep* though.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on June 05, 2012, 01:52:11 pm
Well this has nothing what-so-ever to do with anything being said lol BUT I am completely hung up on this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQYjZc7gKXc)

:o

Subject-drift occurred however, thank you for bringing it back to the context of the thread title, (your video reminds me why I'm against proselytizing as well; it tends to promote dumbing-down).

Well glad I could help lol ! Surely you will admit that Zombies + Sign Language is a pretty bad *bleep* though.

One cannot help but wonder if that video was intended for deaf zombies, (and why there are no deaf or blind zombies depicted on The Walking Dead?).
[Walking Deadline: 4 days and counting down ...]
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on August 10, 2012, 05:14:40 pm
"If you don't want to hear the answer, don't ask the question."
-- anon
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: mhleming on August 13, 2012, 05:10:30 pm
 :wave: In my opinion, I do not think that anything should be dumbed down in any way for any person ever.
"Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death." ~ Albert Einstein
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on August 13, 2012, 05:14:22 pm
:wave: In my opinion, I do not think that anything should be dumbed down in any way for any person ever.

"Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death." ~ Albert Einstein

I agree since my position is that the recipient of any communication has at least one-third of the responsibility for understanding what was communicated, (the other two-thirds are about equally divided between 'transmitter' and 'medium of transmission').  Essentially, if someone doesn't understand what is being communicated, they can either endeavor to "wise-up" or, disregard the message.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: tortiz1 on August 13, 2012, 09:09:06 pm
Im not sure whether or not I should talk about myself dumbing down or wising up or should I talk about society..I've never really blogged or answered anyones blog.... its a first for me... But as far as me dumbing down or wising up I would say that with every day that passes I learn and make the changes necessary to try to avoid making the same mistake more then once.  Sometimes its hard to break hard habits such as biting my nails but everything is all mental and I constantly remind myself how much of a disgusting habit biting my nails are so I don't.  Now about society.  Just like the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting becoming more poor I would say the same applies to wisdom and stupidity.  Those who want change make changes and those who are afraid of change go nowhere and then wonder why.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on August 13, 2012, 09:13:21 pm
Im not sure whether or not I should talk about myself dumbing down or wising up or should I talk about society..I've never really blogged or answered anyones blog.... its a first for me... But as far as me dumbing down or wising up I would say that with every day that passes I learn and make the changes necessary to try to avoid making the same mistake more then once.  Sometimes its hard to break hard habits such as biting my nails but everything is all mental and I constantly remind myself how much of a disgusting habit biting my nails are so I don't.  Now about society.  Just like the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting becoming more poor I would say the same applies to wisdom and stupidity.  Those who want change make changes and those who are afraid of change go nowhere and then wonder why.

That's pragmatically-insightful and I'd estimate that you're wising-up, rather than dumbing-down your experiences.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: vp44 on August 16, 2012, 02:10:13 am
Bigotry is the state of mind of a bigot, defined by Merriam-Webster as "a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially: one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance.
Title: Re: Dumbing-down or wising-up?
Post by: falcon9 on August 16, 2012, 02:21:39 am
Bigotry is the state of mind of a bigot, defined by Merriam-Webster as "a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially: one who regards or treats the members of a group with hatred and intolerance.

"Hatred" is a 'prejudiced hostility' and such does not apply to a logical rejection of irrational superstitious religious beliefs, (especially such superstitious religious beliefs which encompass "bigotry" against those who disbelieve such supersttious or, other belief systems which differ from one another).  

Your specious post, (being out of context of this thread), is a "trolling" post.  As such, the 'troll', (you), will be "fed" that which you cannot digest.
That is, your blind religious faith will not allow you to *see* beyond your sanctimonious self-righteous "intolerance" of challenges to blind faith.