This topic is locked, no replies allowed. Inaccurate or out-of-date info may be present.

  • Print

Topic: The Bible as Truth?  (Read 42572 times)

shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #75 on: July 24, 2010, 08:48:37 pm »
marie,

I want to give you some advice. If you are a STRONG christian, then be strong in your responses. Don't play games with your words. You made a comment about how no one can know if God exists either way but you believe he exists because that's what feels right to you. I'm paraphrasing not direct quoting.

It's okay if you are unsure...that doesn't make you a bad christian but you need to study scriptures and the things in this world that back them, and then YOU WILL KNOW for sure that God exists based on more than your feelings. The bible does not call for blind faith! The atheists and agnostics are ripping you apart because you don't have a sturdy platform to speak from.

I'm not trying to talk down to you, so please don't think that. But you say one thing that appears to be a strong statement and then they upset you and you make a wishy washy statement that contradicts the thing you said before! I applaud that you stick up for yourself, but you need to know that you know that you know that you believe in a God that is real and present in your life! God is calling for strong soldiers who know how to use the two edged sword (the bible) to cut through the lies of Satan that confuse and hurt people. Tell people of God's love! Show them God's love through you!


Falconer02

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 3106 (since 2009)
  • Thanked: 90x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #76 on: July 24, 2010, 10:55:51 pm »
Quote
Just a little food for thought http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuJoC7Lz6SI

This is great. A very basic way to show the problems of the christian afterlife.

Quote
The atheists and agnostics are ripping you apart because you don't have a sturdy platform to speak from.

This has nothing to do with our stances on the topic at hand. She's just a very bad person on the forum. Do not let her fool you- adding her to anything you're debating or discussing will only hurt your words. You don't want to recruit someone who threatens people with violence and wishes them death when they're off their meds. She's crazy.

Quote
The example holds weight, not based on your mother existing or not, but that she is someone you love and I have no right to disrespect you by mocking her.

You have no right to disrespect my mom as I couldn't bring myself to do the same to yours. But this example does not fit because you are giving a physical manifestation to something that does not exist. Unless you can prove otherwise, your example works with anything in the fantasy realm. "But if I were to call your mother a stupid *bleep* and laugh and mock her, would that be ok? I love the invisible telepathic green dragon in my backyard no less than you love your mother so why is it ok for you to poke fun at my dragon?"

Quote
Books with evidence of God

A christian god? Or is it open for evidence of any god? Because I hate to call the bias card...

Quote
The Scientific Case Against Evolution by Robert Locke a NON CREATIONIST
Hey, evolution has some problems. I'll say that...but Robert Locke is an editor though. He brings up some decent points though. What do you personally think all of these strange creatures are that we keep finding?

Quote
Oh and here is a small list of SCIENTISTS who have accepted the Biblical account of creation

Granted this list is just a small fraction of the scientific community, this list really does sadden me. I've probably skimmed a few of their writings too. Do you know any of them? I know that some scientists really want this fantasy to be reality, but when you carry the belief that our world was created in a few days, that we came from dirt and a rib, that sweet-talking demon snakes can exist, that all of our troubles were because of eating lying about fruit, etc....you lose a lot of credibility. I saw a man with his Masters in Astronomy convincing an audience of creationists that the UNIVERSE was no older than 6,000 years. He even went as far as to say there are certain things that slow light down so it appears that the universe is older-- how convenient  :D!

Now yes technically you can apply this reasoning to non-delusioned scientists too when on the opposite side. But would you rather be with the open world discovering new things or would you rather be packed away in a tight box with limited reasoning that works around those newly discovered things and always slaps a "GOD" label on everything? I think you've seen this- http://img389.imageshack.us/f/sciencevfaith20yp6ds3.png/

Quote
I used to think I was so unworthy of God that it made me feel small and ashamed. I had secret dark things in me that I kept hidden for fear of being judged by people. But I found out God's grace covers all that. I have been promiscuous, committed adultery, lied, stole, cheated, manipulated, judging, hypocritical, addicted to pornography, drugs, and alcohol, abusive, hateful, vindictive, unforgiving.....in my mind, I committed murder and torture and schemed all kinds of things.....

Quit yo jibba-jabbin'! This ain't no AA meeting! You's a nice person! We're not going to judge you over past things. Partially because some of these things have cases for being philosophically good. It's not all black and white with nonbelievers  :)
« Last Edit: July 24, 2010, 11:04:02 pm by Falconer02 »

shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #77 on: July 24, 2010, 11:19:50 pm »
Quote
I have to say, in the short amount of time that I have been posting on these forums, I have found you to be one of the nicest people here.  You disagree, but you don't personally attack, and I admire you for this.

And I have to say I disagree with you on the fare for heaven.  I have a hard time believing that a man who devoted his life to helping others (a small story that stuck with me from Chicken Soup for the Jewish Soul) but did not adhere to any religion would be denied heaven while a rapist or murderer that accepted Christ on his deathbed would be welcomed.  If that is what I have to look forward to; meeting my god fearing rapist in heaven, then I'd much rather face non-existence.

Well, I don't know every aspect and dimension of what you believe so I am going to stick with what I know in order to reply to this...Oh and thank you for the complement by the way....

It doesn't say in the bible that God put conditions on forgiveness of sins. He doesn't say that one sin is greater than another. There is a scripture that says the one unforgivable sin is to blaspheme the holy spirit. It is to my understanding that to blaspheme the holy is to hold unforgiveness in your heart towards another.  The act of Christ on the cross as God in flesh is the ultimate act of forgiveness and it made provision for every person willing to accept Jesus as their savior. To hold unforgiveness is to go against the very nature of God (his Holy Spirit)
And when you stand praying, forgive, if you have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive you your trespasses. Mark 11:25,26

Now I realize your not christian but I'm explaining why I believe what I believe according the scripture that I live from.

So, God will only NOT forgive us when we come before Him with unforgiveness in our hearts towards others. We ALL need forgiveness for one sin or another and the rapist, and the murderer, and the liar, and the drug abuser, and the child abuser, HORRIBLE as we may see one behavior over another....God sees only a sin. Every person has value regardless of their misdeeds, and anyone willing to cry out to God He will hear them and forgive them. We have no right to say who deserves forgiveness. And truly if I were to meet MY rapist in heaven (because I have one) I would be overwhelmed with joy because my prayers were answered and God saved Him! It took a long time for me to pray for my rapist and to really forgive him but eventually my heart hurt because I knew that God didn't love me any more than He loved the person who hurt me and it was my responsibility to pray for Him.

And this is what Christianity should be teaching because that is the "Good News"

And this also goes back to earning your way into heaven. It sets up a mindset that causes people to try and live up to a standard their whole life and they can't keep up. They do something wrong and feel guilty and then try to do enough good to make up for the bad and hope that it's good enough to keep them out of hell! That sounds like a miserable existence to me. I would rather know that, my desire to do good and my love for God is enough for Him. When I mess up and drop the ball, I don't have to feel guilty but let the grace of God do it's job and I pick up and keep going. I live a guilt free life  :)

I simply want to let people know that they can have that too!

Now my whole answer was based on my own christian faith...however your being Jewish by no means implies you're going to hell for rejecting Christ. Paul also tells us that those who follow the law (e.g., practicing Jews) will be judged by the law.
For there is no partiality with God. For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law; and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; (Romans 2:11-12)

I prefer not to be judged by the law because I scarcely understand it  ;)
I prefer Jesus  :)


shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #78 on: July 24, 2010, 11:43:25 pm »
Falconer, you're not understanding my point. So ok, you have justified to yourself that it was okay to mock me because I made a "delusional" statement in regards to having a close enough relationship to God that I can feel my spirit connect with His Holy Spirit.

I think evolutionary theory stating how we came to be on this planet is delusional but I don't mock you on a personal level for believing something I consider RIDICULOUS!

Quote
when you carry the belief that our world was created in a few days,
I believe the Old Earth Creation Theory

As for what I personally think about sudden appearances of fossils....considering fossils are rare I would imagine that it just so happened to be the first fossil discovered of that particular species. It doesn't mean that it burst into existence from nothing or leaped radically from one species to a complete different, and it certainly contradicts proving gradual changes which were necessary for Darwins theory to be worth anything.

Quote
You's a nice person! We're not going to judge you over past things.
Thank you. I don't care about people judging me anymore, that was partly my point. I only care what God thinks about me and He didn't judge me of all those things and I'm confidant in how much He loves me.


shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #79 on: July 24, 2010, 11:53:28 pm »
OH and I'm not trying to "recruit" anyone. I'm simply trying to help another person become stronger in their faith. She may have confessed mental issues but she is no less a person because of it.


queenofnines

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 2180 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 44x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #80 on: July 25, 2010, 08:33:15 am »
I see a bad car accident coming your way, and queen can confirm there was a bad accident that came her way. I didn't quote anything when I said it. Just because I am psychic and I can see things doesn't mean I am wishing them or sending them your way.

You're a loon!   ::)  How is it psychic when you didn't get the person right (the threat was directed at Falconer)?  How is it psychic when this "bad accident" you predicted turned out to leave our car perfectly untouched?  People who pray or claim to be psychic are way too easily impressed...

If you are psychic, why don't you pick out the next Powerball numbers rather than mooching off the government?  Just a thought.   :thumbsup:
"It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
-- Carl Sagan

queenofnines

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 2180 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 44x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #81 on: July 25, 2010, 09:01:45 am »
So, God will only NOT forgive us when we come before Him with unforgiveness in our hearts towards others. We ALL need forgiveness for one sin or another and the rapist, and the murderer, and the liar, and the drug abuser, and the child abuser, HORRIBLE as we may see one behavior over another....God sees only a sin.

And that's why people call Christianity delusional because a white lie is nowhere near the same thing as raping and murdering a slew of women.

Quote
And truly if I were to meet MY rapist in heaven (because I have one) I would be overwhelmed with joy because my prayers were answered and God saved Him!

WOW.  This makes me extremely sad.  I'm so sorry that you had to through that...but let me just say, as a good, kind human being, you're ALLOWED to not forgive your rapist.  Certainly don't go out and murder his whole family or whatever, but it's okay to feel ANGRY; it's okay to want him to get locked up and hope he receives the death penalty.  Because it's absolutely shameful and inexcusable what he did.  He doesn't deserve to be tortured endlessly for ONE lifetime of evil (in hell)...but what he doesn't deserve even more is to be REWARDED for such vile behavior that wrecked your life.  HE DESERVES TO BE REMOVED FROM SOCIETY VIA JAIL OR THE DEATH PENALTY - NOTHING MORE, NOTHING LESS.  Earthly jail isn't good enough for most people; they believe god will torture the bad guys forever because they "deserve it".  To burn a rapist forever OR to allow him to live in bliss forever simply because he "believed" - both of these are extremely unjust.

It saddens me that Christianity takes advantage of people who have been through horrible stuff.  It tells you to bury the angry, hurt feelings that you're entitled to have as a human being who has been wronged...You MUST FORGIVE HIM and accept that he deserves heaven just as much as you do even if we waits until he's on his deathbed to believe in Jesus and has raped 60 women within his lifetime.  "Good News"?  Ha!

Quote
When I mess up and drop the ball, I don't have to feel guilty but let the grace of God do it's job and I pick up and keep going. I live a guilt free life  :)

I have a video I watched yesterday that addresses why this get-out-of-guilt-free business is WRONG: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2nf_i4HX_Y&videos=gxJJaui2CM0 (warning: it's a little offensive)  If the readers don't chose to watch it, the basic message is that Christianity is harmful because it dupes people into believing they are free from responsibility whenever they do something wrong.
"It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
-- Carl Sagan

Cuppycake

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 2910 (since 2008)
  • Thanked: 26x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #82 on: July 25, 2010, 09:18:38 am »
I see a bad car accident coming your way, and queen can confirm there was a bad accident that came her way. I didn't quote anything when I said it. Just because I am psychic and I can see things doesn't mean I am wishing them or sending them your way.

You're a loon!   ::)  How is it psychic when you didn't get the person right (the threat was directed at Falconer)?  How is it psychic when this "bad accident" you predicted turned out to leave our car perfectly untouched?  People who pray or claim to be psychic are way too easily impressed...

If you are psychic, why don't you pick out the next Powerball numbers rather than mooching off the government?  Just a thought.   :thumbsup:
She is more then a loon she is a psychopath!

queenofnines

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 2180 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 44x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #83 on: July 25, 2010, 09:21:41 am »
I believe the Old Earth Creation Theory

And what it that, exactly?  That each "day" in Genesis is really an "age" or "era"?

"FACT: the world is at least 4.6 billion years old.  The bible claims to be approximately 6,500.  Christians try to argue this by saying the usage of the word “day” in genesis is actually a term for thousands of years in time.  This rationalization, they believe can help evolution be accepted into the bible. In other words Christians are trying to say that the word “day” is not meant to be as a 24 hour period.  This idea is COMPLETELY FALSE AND NOT PLAUSIBLE.  All it takes is a little research into the meaning of the Hebrew word for day and the usage of it in consistency.  

Of course, it should be common knowledge that the first five books of the Old Testament were written in Hebrew.  The Hebrew word for day used in the genesis is account is “yom”, which is a definite 24-hour period.  Christians attempt to say that because there was no sun until the fourth day, that the word yom is null and void.  This cant be, for the lord claimed there was light, a morning and an evening PRIOR to the sun being created, hence the sun was not even needed.  (Also note another contradiction here, that Christians/Jews refuse to notice. They’ll claim the word yom is void because there is no sun, yet that would mean that there couldn’t have been light or a way to decipher between morning and evening. Obviously this is a MAJOR scientific blunder on Jehovah’s behalf.)  

Now this fact alone pretty much blows the sh*t out of the bible, but let’s pretend to accept the word yom is really meant for eons of time, how then can we reconcile the following?:

1) If a day is an era, why are an evening and a morning even mentioned?  Actual days must be intended, otherwise, men who lived hundreds of years, e.g., Seth and Noah, would really have lived millions of years.  If a day is an era, then a year must be tremendously long, perhaps encompassing hundreds of millions of years;

2) If a day is an era, then much of the Old Testament becomes chaotic.  For example, in each of the following verses the same Hebrew word “yom” is employed: “And the flood was forty days upon the earth” (Genesis 7: 1 7), “And he [Moses] was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights” (Exodus 34:28), and “Thus I fell down before the Lord forty days and forty nights...” (Deuteronomy 9:25). If “yom” means era instead of a 24-hour period, Moses was “there with the Lord” for a VERY long time.

3) If a day means more than 24-hour period, then how are we to interpret the following verses, as well as scores of others.  “Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath. . . . in it thou shalt not work... For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth… and rested the seventh day” (Exodus 20:9-11).

4) Genesis 1:16 (“And God made two great lights: The greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night”) states the sun rules the day and the moon rules the night.  This obviously is referring to time as we know it, time with days that are 24 hours long with daylight ruling half of each.

5) Adam was made on the sixth day (Genesis 1:26-31) which was supposedly thousand of years long.  This was followed by the 7th day which was also thousands of years long. Following the 7th day, Adam fell into sin and was expelled from the Garden.  This would mean Adam lived thousands of years, which is false, since he died at age 930 (Genesis 5:5).

6) Genesis 1:5 surely spoke of literal day and literal night, and the inference from the statement, “And the evening and the morning were the first day,” is that it was a literal day of evening and morning, 24-hours.  There is no Biblical evidence that the days of this chapter were longer periods.


For those of you Christians who are STILL clinging to the idea that evolution can be reconciled with the bible, take a little advice from one of your own brethren on the matter. The following is a CHRISTIAN AUTHOR who admits that the word yom does mean a 24 hour period in the creation account:

"The Hebrew word for ‘day’ is ‘yom’ and this word can occasionally be used to mean an indefinite period of time, if the content warrants.  In the overwhelming preponderance of its occurrences in the O.T., however, it means a literal day…  Still further, the plural form of the word (Hebrew 'yamim') is used over 700 times in the O.T. and always, without exception, refers to literal ‘days.’"  (The Bible Has the Answers, Henry Morris, p. 94).

Obviously even Creationist Morris admits the idea that each day represented an era is ridiculous. Not only is the day-age theory unacceptable scripturally, but it also is grossly in conflict with the geological position with which it attempts to compromise.  My suggestion?  Make a valid justification as to how the creation account can be plausible, until then don’t pimp feeble lies to cover up for your even more errant book." ~ http://www.evilbible.com/a_day_is_a_day.htm
« Last Edit: July 25, 2010, 09:27:03 am by queenofnines »
"It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
-- Carl Sagan

ButterflyWings

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1075 (since 2008)
  • Thanked: 1x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #84 on: July 25, 2010, 09:49:13 am »
Ok I was gonna just walk away then something stopped me and I had to open my big mouth..The rapist thing..K I was raped at nine and I am sorry if I had to spend eternity with him in heaven then I would rather go to hell.(even though I have no real belief in either just saying) Sorry I was a innocent child so in my eyes he is evil and deserves no forgiveness or anything else just to suffer the way I did for years after what he did..I was not the first or last and he is out among other children..So if your god forgives him then I am sickened cause that is twisted..

amyrouse

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1274 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #85 on: July 25, 2010, 10:35:07 am »
The rapist thing..K I was raped at nine and I am sorry if I had to spend eternity with him in heaven then I would rather go to hell...So if your god forgives him then I am sickened cause that is twisted..

I agree completely.  A rapist does not just harm for minutes but for life.  A rape survivor has to contend with the fact that they were violated for the rest of their lives.  They have to learn to trust people again; they deal with fear on a daily basis.  Even when a survivor has recovered somewhat and can live a somewhat secure and normal life, something inevitable comes along that triggers the emotional response...like childbirth or a death in the family...meeting your life partner and falling in love.  Who can you trust?  What parts of your life can you enjoy with true freedom?  And the scum that performed the act that brought this on...they deserve heaven based solely on the fact that they said "I'm so sorry, god.  I know now it was wrong for me to do that, and I believe you died for my sins."? Forgive me for being bitter...I'm only human.



queenofnines

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Gold Member
  • ********
  • Posts: 2180 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 44x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #86 on: July 25, 2010, 11:06:18 am »
HAHA thank God you're not a psychiatrist and besides I think only a psychiatrist can make that diagnosis, so hush.

How do you know I'm not?  I could have a home business or provide services online.

Psychiatrist or not, it's in a person's best interest to make JUDGEMENT CALLS to protect themselves from other people.  It doesn't take a Ph.D. for a user of this forum to know that you have the mental state of a 12-year-old...whether it's your fault or not.

I'd also like to note that I observed you for a couple months before I ever said anything "bad" about you, because when I saw others calling you a troll, crazy, etc. I wanted to make sure they were justified.  They were.

I also censor my criticisms, btw, to make them more "gentle" so I don't come across as a flaming b*tch.

Quote
You have to listen to the thoughts that are in your mind, they are different than normal thoughts, these thoughts tell you thngs that are about to happen.

There is a scientific, evolutionary basis for humans having an "intuition" -- just so you know.
"It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
-- Carl Sagan

shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #87 on: July 25, 2010, 11:12:19 am »
That's why God is God and men aren't the judge of the universe. God healed me of the psychological trauma of being raped, so I don't feel the pain from it anymore.  I have true freedom through being able to forgive the person that hurt me. On top of the fact, that someone who made a mistake has the chance of redemption.

By your standards, everyone would go to hell. Have you lied?? Has your lie hurt somebody?? Oh well, sorry then perhaps the person you hurt by your lie doesn't want to be in heaven with you and by their judgment you shouldn't be allowed to go. That's human judgment, not God's. I'm thankful to believe and trust in a God that gives people another chance.

As for someone who rapes and does it continually, they obviously have not repented and accepted Christ or they wouldn't still be doing it. In which case, they wouldn't go to heaven.

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your FAther which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rice on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.Matthew 5:45,46



shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #88 on: July 25, 2010, 11:23:31 am »
Old Earth Creation vs Young Earth Creation
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/creation.html

Funny how despite all the holes and flaws and contradictions with evolution, and even non biased evolutionary scientists making statements regarding the fallacies and inconsistencies, people are still turning a blind eye to the scientific evidences found for Creation. Funny indeed.

Cool Things About Being An Evolutionist
10. You can call "punctuated equilibrium" a scientific theory, then explain why scientific evidence for it cannot be found.

9. When a student tries to raise critical scientific questions of evolution in science class, you tell him he can only ask them in a course on comparative religions.

8. To show transitional forms in school textbooks, you just hire an artist to invent some.

7. You can ignore Phillip Johnson's book "Defeating Darwinism - By Opening Minds" and write your own: "Defeating Creation & Intelligent Design - By Closing Minds".

6. You can refer to books by atheists Stephen Jay Gould and Richard Dawkins as "Holy Writ".

5. If in need of spare cash, rob a bank and call it "natural selection".

4. You get to cross out the word "God" and print "Hydrogen" at Genesis 1:1.
 
3. You get to use quotation marks around the word "scientists" when writing about creationists who received their Ph.D.'s from major universities.

2. To convince the public that "Lucy" [Australopithecus afarensis] was one of man's ancestors, you fashion perfectly formed human hands and feet (and a pensive look) on a statue of a primate.

And the number one cool thing about being an evolutionist is:

1. You don't have to make any distinction between fact and wild speculation.


shernajwine

    US flag
    View Profile
  • Silver Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1299 (since 2010)
  • Thanked: 0x
Re: The Bible as Truth?
« Reply #89 on: July 25, 2010, 11:34:45 am »
Quote
I have a video I watched yesterday that addresses why this get-out-of-guilt-free business is WRONG
It's not a get out of guilt free....
Romans Chapter6 American Standard Bible (ignore the parenthesed letters)
 1(A)What shall we say then? Are we to (B)continue in sin so that grace may increase?

 2(C)May it never be! How shall we who (D)died to sin still live in it?

 3Or do you not know that all of us who have been (E)baptized into (F)Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death?

 4Therefore we have been (G)buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was (H)raised from the dead through the (I)glory of the Father, so we too might walk in (J)newness of life.

 5For (K)if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection,

 6knowing this, that our (L)old self was (M)crucified with Him, in order that our (N)body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin;

 7for (O)he who has died is freed from sin.

 8Now (P)if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,

 9knowing that Christ, having been (Q)raised from the dead, is never to die again; (R)death no longer is master over Him.

 10For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.

 11Even so consider yourselves to be (S)dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

 12Therefore do not let sin (T)reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,

 13and do not go on (U)presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but (V)present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.

 14For (W)sin shall not (X)be master over you, for (Y)you are not under law but (Z)under grace.

 15What then? (AA)Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? (AB)May it never be!

 16Do you not (AC)know that when you present yourselves to someone as (AD)slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of (AE)sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

 17But (AF)thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that (AG)form of teaching to which you were committed,

 18and having been (AH)freed from sin, you became slaves of righteousness.

 19(AI)I am speaking in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh For just (AJ)as you presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness, resulting in further lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness, resulting in sanctification.

 20For (AK)when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

 21Therefore what (AL)benefit were you then deriving from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the outcome of those things is (AM)death.

 22But now having been (AN)freed from sin and (AO)enslaved to God, you derive your (AP)benefit, resulting in sanctification, and (AQ)the outcome, eternal life.

 23For the wages of (AR)sin is death, but the free gift of God is (AS)eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.


  • Print
 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
18 Replies
3451 Views
Last post November 04, 2011, 08:14:34 pm
by gemini0314
1 Replies
1155 Views
Last post September 27, 2012, 04:16:15 pm
by remediagirl
12 Replies
1489 Views
Last post November 13, 2012, 03:00:00 am
by jowbow
Truth

Started by Gerianne in Off-Topic

2 Replies
947 Views
Last post January 13, 2013, 07:55:06 am
by bigfoot951
47 Replies
4394 Views
Last post May 29, 2019, 05:55:47 pm
by mapiklfish