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Discussion Boards => Off-Topic => Topic started by: boomer2433 on December 21, 2009, 03:00:46 pm
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Do the politicians care that this bill might bankrupt the country?
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Health Care Bill STUPID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumbsup:
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No. They are just worried about how much they can fill their pockets.
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
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This bill will bankrupt our country, and no, all politicans care about is getting re-elected. There are so many problems with this healthcare bill, so I am just going to list them off.
1. It goes against something called The Constitution. Since when does the government have the power to force us to buy something even if we dont want it. And if we dont pay into the healthcare package we will be fined. 10th Ammendment says that any powers not given to the federal government by the constitution are held by the states and the people. Having a federal healthcare system is not listed as a power of the federal government, so it would go against the Constitution.
2. The cost. Now, these are the numbers I have, you might of heard differnt, but I'm just stating what I was told, so correct me if I'm wrong. From 2010-2019, it would cost $900 billion. Then from 2020-2029, it would cost over $1 trillion. Now didnt Obama say he would not sign a healthcare bill that raises the national debt? Seem like this bill would put us in the hole quite a bit more than we already are.
3. If this bill is to pass, we would start paying for it right away. But it would not go into effect untill 2013. If I go down to the Ford dealership and buy a new truck, I want it now. I dont want to make payemts on it for 3 years before I can use it. And for the date of 2013 before it starts, wel, what happens in 2012. Elections. So if this healthcare falls on it behind before re-election time, Obama is probablly not going to get re-elected. But if it dosent go into effect after the elections, he dosent have to worry about that.
4. Obama said it would not go to fund abortoins or supply healthcare to illegal immigrants. Guess what it does?
The list could go on and on, but I will end here.
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
There are plenty of government programs and charitable organizations to help people that are down on their luck. Too many programs, if you ask me.
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This health care bill is a huge mistake, and a mistake that we will be paying forever. I strongly feel that the country will dig a hole so deep, that there will be no climbing out of. Forcing people to sign up for a health plan and then fining them if they don't is an absolute disgrace. Where has the freedom to choose gone? Taxes WILL go up, there is no doubt about that, and more taxes will be put on things that are not taxed right now.
We will all suffer in the end, thats the bottom line.
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I disagree with a lot of it and disagree how it's being done purely on a partisan basis.
What I would like to ask is: Why do I see people picketing the streets about mandatory health insurance, but I don't see a single person screaming about mandatory car insurance? You know what happens when you get caught without car insurance? You get a fine/imprisoned. Have some consistency or shut up.
Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
There are plenty of government programs and charitable organizations to help people that are down on their luck. Too many programs, if you ask me.
How can there be too many charitable organizations when there is such a huge amount of suffering and distress in the world? -.- What a nonsensical notion...
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As part of treaties where many NDN Nations gave up huge amounts of land, we were promised as partial payment, health care.
The service is only as good as the provider.
For anyone interested in a clue of how an universal health care system provided by your gov would be, just google Indian Health Services.
There it is care provided by your government......purty ennit?
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
What about Medicaid, or other state and federal programs? There is lots of help for low income families. The statistics are twisted to warp public opinion in favor of government control. Many of the uninsured are young people who don't want to pay for it, or people who are between jobs, or the very rich. Its not the poor, who are already taken care of.
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What I would like to ask is: Why do I see people picketing the streets about mandatory health insurance, but I don't see a single person screaming about mandatory car insurance? You know what happens when you get caught without car insurance? You get a fine/imprisoned. Have some consistency or shut up.
That's a good point. It seems we've swallowed this already and forgotten about it. Now I'm worried in a decade that it will be the same way with this topic...
I'm against it completely. I see so many antagonistic qualities about it constantly that even authors are publishing books on it. The national debt is so high that it truly scares me and I honestly don't want to see us citizens paying it off through massive tax increases. This seems like assurance that it will happen.
I keep seeing current stories of people in different countries moving out of their homeland due to similar circumstances-- that the gov't goes beyond unfairness. If this keeps up I wonder if we'll see a massive migration of people out of the US in the future.
Many of the uninsured are young people who don't want to pay for it, or people who are between jobs, or the very rich.
Don't want to? How about people that have pre-existing conditions that can't get it? I'd add that since it's a huge one.
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No. They are just worried about how much they can fill their pockets.
+1 to that almost everybody is the government is corrupt to the bone and only care about themselves. :bs:
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why health care everybody should be getting out there and working
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;)
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...what?
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Americans need to wake up and start fighting for control over whats happens to them. We need to wake up and take back control from the government. I came over to this country 17 years ago from Ireland and I have seen this country change from a free country where you can speak and not be judged to you need to watch every word coming out of your mouth (thats just one example). Don't just settle for what you have, do something about it.
I don't want to offend anyone here, but thats how feel. I love this country and want it to be the country it used to be before liberals dicatated our every move, what we can or cannot do. Americans need to get back their fight and wakeup.
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Evil liberals and their dictatorship!
I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
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is very important in the usa.
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People don't raise their fists any more because they are too lazy to fight for what they want. They are too busy waiting to see someone else do it for them.
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is already covered by Medicare.
I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
I'll take this one, assuming you're willing to debate someone that can compete with you ;)
The government has never mandated a requirement to pay roughly a quarter of your income directly to a large for-profit business.
What I find humorous, is that you would endorse something like this.
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Evil liberals and their dictatorship!
I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
You should not assume that folks with an opinion about politics are uneducated in the area of political science. I for one have taken political science in college (I have a Masters Degree) and have a very good understanding about politics and how it affects our lives every day. My eyes are wide open as to what is happening in our country today.
I value your opinion and salute you for voicing it :)
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I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
I'll take this one, assuming you're willing to debate someone that can compete with you ;)
The government has never mandated a requirement to pay roughly a quarter of your income directly to a large for-profit business.
What I find humorous, is that you would endorse something like this.
There's really no debate to be had. I already said very early in the thread that I disagree with a lot of the current bill and how it's being done purely on a partisan basis. I am in no way endorsing the majority of the current bill (I will, however, continue to endorse a universal system). I support barring insurance companies from denying people with pre-conditions or from "shedding" people with chronic illnesses, I support the bill's attempts to limit insurance company profits, I support the elderly getting nearly all their prescription drugs covered, I support people with modest to high incomes being able to purchase care at better prices than are currently available.
I'm merely asking people why they're just now starting to complain about government mandates on anything. I simply think it's a horrible criticism of the bill when there are so many more legitimate criticisms.
Evil liberals and their dictatorship!
I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
You should not assume that folks with an opinion about politics are uneducated in the area of political science. I for one have taken political science in college (I have a Masters Degree) and have a very good understanding about politics and how it affects our lives every day. My eyes are wide open as to what is happening in our country today.
I value your opinion and salute you for voicing it :)
Then you should easily recognize pinning blame for the state of this nation solely on liberal principles is ridiculous and beyond baseless?
As for assuming, I don't see such an assumption being an issue when barely a quarter of the population has a college degree, the average person can't name their local or federal representatives, can't tell you when this country was founded, doesn't know the difference between the Constitution and Declaration of Independence, can't tell you the most obvious details of more than one or two issues, etc. etc. In other words, I assume most people I come into contact with don't pay attention to politics and thus spout whatever headlines they hear. Why? Because that is actually how most people are based on the polling of the general American public.
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I laugh a lot when average people (ie people who haven't taken a single political science course or really studied the subject at all) try to analyze situations and think they're doing a good job at it. I don't claim to be an expert, but if your entire claim rests on the basis of "evil liberals" and "government mandates," your case sucks hard. The government mandates an amazing amount of things that I see no fist-raising over. It's humorous.
I'll take this one, assuming you're willing to debate someone that can compete with you ;)
The government has never mandated a requirement to pay roughly a quarter of your income directly to a large for-profit business.
What I find humorous, is that you would endorse something like this.
There's really no debate to be had. I already said very early in the thread that I disagree with the current bill and how it's being done purely on a partisan basis. I am in no way endorsing the current bill (I will, however, continue to endorse a universal system).
I'm merely asking people why they're just now starting to complain about government mandates. I imagine it has something to do with the money. In which case, the question still stands.
I don't know. A lot of the Tea Party movement, really don't like government mandates of any sort. Income tax, property tax. They're basically 21st century tribalists.
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I really have no desire to get into what the Tea Party Movement wants. I will say I think it's reasonable to assume most of the Tea Party goers are conservatives who supported, and probably continue to support, our efforts in the Middle East. I find that slightly odd given they're generally opposed to taxation (or overbearing taxation) and government spending.
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Well...it passed this morning. 60 to 39. Just thought you'd all like to know.
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Get ready to pay 1500.00 a month for health care for a family of four
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I think the tax wave only majorly effects individuals/families who make over 250k a year. Anyone have some decent sources on how this will effect everyone?
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I sure didn't vote for him :thumbsup:
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I sure didn't vote for him :thumbsup:
"He" hasn't signed it yet.
He most likely will but this was the senate not the prez who voted.
From what I read it is not a done deal yet.
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I sure didn't vote for him :thumbsup:
"He" hasn't signed it yet.
He most likely will but this was the senate not the prez who voted.
From what I read it is not a done deal yet.
Obama and the democrats have been pushing for it. Obama is trying to freak out americans by saying we will all die if it doesn't go through. As far as I know, we have made it just fine since Medicare was put in in the 1930s. Obama should be killed for a terrible president he is and Harry Reid will burn in hell.
Your Democrats don't want you to figure out what is in this bill so they passed it quickly. It will only help 10% of us and the other 90%...well we will be stuck paying ridiculous amounts to a government who is now monopolizing health care and will raise prices, spend MORE SPEND MORE SPEND MORE GO MORE IN DEBT SPEND MORE and then TAX TAX TAX MORE.
Thank you for all of the idiots who voted for Obama. Do you still see hope and change? You are truly the idiots.
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I sure didn't vote for him :thumbsup:
"He" hasn't signed it yet.
He most likely will but this was the senate not the prez who voted.
From what I read it is not a done deal yet.
Obama and the democrats have been pushing for it. Obama is trying to freak out americans by saying we will all die if it doesn't go through. As far as I know, we have made it just fine since Medicare was put in in the 1930s. Obama should be killed for a terrible president he is and Harry Reid will burn in hell.
Your Democrats don't want you to figure out what is in this bill so they passed it quickly. It will only help 10% of us and the other 90%...well we will be stuck paying ridiculous amounts to a government who is now monopolizing health care and will raise prices, spend MORE SPEND MORE SPEND MORE GO MORE IN DEBT SPEND MORE and then TAX TAX TAX MORE.
Thank you for all of the idiots who voted for Obama. Do you still see hope and change? You are truly the idiots.
"MY" Democrats??
Well what a great xmas gift, but really you shouldn't have, especially considering I don't even vote in "YOUR" governments elections.
.....now I guess I have to come up with something equally useless to give to you in return huh?
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it's not a finished thing yet for sure
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i love the new health care plan
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What? And fertilize the lawn? Pfft.
Obama should be killed for a terrible president he is and Harry Reid will burn in hell.
Wow. How American of you.
Thank you for all of the idiots who voted for Obama. Do you still see hope and change? You are truly the idiots.
As opposed to a man who pretty much wanted a similar bill in place...who had many health problems...and a laughing-stock of a VP. Thanks for the well-thought conclusion.
!!!!!!EVERYONE VOTE RON PAUL 2012!!!!!!
it's not a finished thing yet for sure
Correct. There are many more steps to this than the one this morning. Granted we have a dem majority now...let us hope they wise up and be more cautious of this potential bomb.
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I sure didn't vote for him :thumbsup:
"He" hasn't signed it yet.
He most likely will but this was the senate not the prez who voted.
From what I read it is not a done deal yet.
Obama and the democrats have been pushing for it. Obama is trying to freak out americans by saying we will all die if it doesn't go through. As far as I know, we have made it just fine since Medicare was put in in the 1930s. Obama should be killed for a terrible president he is and Harry Reid will burn in hell.
Your Democrats don't want you to figure out what is in this bill so they passed it quickly. It will only help 10% of us and the other 90%...well we will be stuck paying ridiculous amounts to a government who is now monopolizing health care and will raise prices, spend MORE SPEND MORE SPEND MORE GO MORE IN DEBT SPEND MORE and then TAX TAX TAX MORE.
Thank you for all of the idiots who voted for Obama. Do you still see hope and change? You are truly the idiots.
I lol'd. Well done dude
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It's your president Were in a world of???? NOW :thumbsup:
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
There are plenty of government programs and charitable organizations to help people that are down on their luck. Too many programs, if you ask me.
Scruffy seconds this.
I worked my way up from an impoverished home into a decent life with coverage and financial stability.
It CAN be done.
Too many people play it fast and lose with their finances and expect someone to bail them out.
Hence why the American economy is the way it is currently.
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Too many people play it fast and lose with their finances and expect someone to bail them out.
Hence why the American economy is the way it is currently.
Well yeah this is a major part of it...but it's also caused by banks and businesses being ridiculously naive and lending out cash to these people. With all these bailout packages that are being released, are we simply rewarding failure?
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All I can think is when I hear people screaming and complaining about these kinds of things is, it must no be too bad because you KEEP HAVING BABIES!!!!!!!!!!
I will never have kids because LIFE SUCKS.
I am sorry that you seem troubled or unhappy. Life is not a bed of roses all of the time, but it certainly does not "suck"
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Don't argue with her, man. You won't get anywhere.
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I really have no desire to get into what the Tea Party Movement wants. I will say I think it's reasonable to assume most of the Tea Party goers are conservatives who supported, and probably continue to support, our efforts in the Middle East. I find that slightly odd given they're generally opposed to taxation (or overbearing taxation) and government spending.
No, they're generally Libertarian, and they don't want foreign wars or a large standing military.
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Does anyone care that millions are walking around without healthcare, take for example, the mom with 3 kids, husband got bored and wanted to look for someone younger and left the mom, no child support to pay bills nothing, she has to work 2 part time jobs, and can't even pay bills, and health care, forget that, neither of the jobs offer it. So what are her kids supposed to do.
This is an example, I am not in this situation, but I have seen many who are, and until you see some of the poor and middle class in this country fighting to pay bills, keep food on the table, and no healthcare, you cannot speak for them.
I can speak for them, because I am a young mother. I have three kids and although I am married, my husbands job requires almost $300 a week out of his paycheck to cover the insurance. On the other hand, we make too much money for Medicaid.