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Discussion Boards => Off-Topic => Debate & Discuss => Topic started by: amyrouse on August 15, 2010, 09:19:21 pm
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This topic is inspired by discussion in another thread.
It seems (to me, anyway) that we as Americans tend to pick up on the buzz of indignities and otherwise wretched situations occurring all over the world and have a tendency to overlook what is happening in our own backyard.
* We were attacked on September 11, 2001 and nearly 3000 people died in those attacks. In 2008, the murder rate in America was over 16,000. That is over five WTC attacks per year...and we're doing it to ourselves. http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.htm
* Rape per capita is the worst in South Africa, as nearly one and a quarter women per 1000 is raped annually, or over 50,000. The US is #9 per capita, though, with one woman in less than 4000 raped annually, or over 95,000. Yes, the amount per capita is astounding in South Africa; however, a larger population of women are reporting being raped in the US (speaking of rape...is anyone else astounded at how people rationalize it or blame the victim? Maybe if people weren't so quick to further victimize the survivor, more rapes would be reported.) http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap-crime-rapes
* When was the last time you heard about helping out in Haiti? In 2007, it is estimated that over 700,000 people were homeless in the United States. In this year's official decennial census, we will have a new estimation, but I can speak from experience working on the service based project in the Census (soup kitchens, shelters, targeted non-sheltered outdoor locations a.k.a. tent cities, and mobile food vans) that we were not able to count everyone. There were also people coming to the soup kitchens that were not homeless but could not afford a meal and relied on the churches in my town to help (the majority of soup kitchens and shelters where I live are church run, not state funded). http://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/How_Many.html
* Speaking of impoverished Americans: There are 46 million uninsured Americans (from those who cannot afford insurance, to those who are ineligible due to pre-existing conditions or poor health, to those who can afford to not pay health insurance). There are 50 million on medicaid, and 45 million on medicare http://www.hhs.gov. There are 40 million Americans on food stamps http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supplemental_Nutrition_Assistance_Program, nearly 15 million on payroll unemployment (not including those who do not get an unemployment check) http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm, and less than 4 million on TANF. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporary_Assistance_for_Needy_Families
I'm sure there are other topics that will be mentioned over the discussion; here are a few to start with.
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This past February I traveled to the Chyenne River Lakota Sioux Reservation in South Dakota to help with relief efforts after multiple blizzards snapped every power poles for miles around as well as other severe damages. It was very sureal to look down the highway and see all those huge poles simply snapped like tooth picks from the ice that had accumulated on the wires and the intense winds. Couple that with -25 degree temperatures and you may imagine the desperate need to get the power back up and running. The entire Rez which is hundreds of square miles can only afford two snowplows and ost of the Rez was immobile, without power or anyway to acquire life sustaining supplies.
Since I spent the entire month there I had opportunity to visit a few of the other Rez's in the state as well(there are 9) the conditions on the Pineridge Oglala Sioux Rez was appalling even in much fairer weather........
http://socyberty.com/subcultures/pine-ridge-reservation-americas-own-third-world-country/
"I have never quite understood people who travel oversees and put forth so much effort to help those in Under developed countries, when we have a place right here in the US that has Third World conditions. Technically, this place is not “in the United States.” It is an Indian Reservation, therefore a Sovereign Nation.
The place to which I am referring is Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota. I first became aware of it several years ago when I began traveling back and forth from Omaha, Nebraska, to the Black Hills. When I heard the statistics, I was shocked. When I SAW the conditions, I was mortified. Here are just a few of the FYI’s about Pine Ridge Reservation;
* The Average life expectancy on the Reservation is 46
* Pine Ridge Teen suicide rate is 150 times higher than the National Average
* 65% of the residents of the Reservation live in sub-standard conditions such as no electricity, running water, and often, without heat
* Many of the elderly (some of whom still live in sod houses) die of Hypothermia each year
* Average income is $2600 to $3500
* Due to lack of sustainable jobs on the Reservation, unemployment is approximately 85-95%
* Infant Mortality rate is 300% above National Average
* There are NO commercial, industry or technology infrastructures on the Reservation to provide employment
* Diabetes is 800 times higher than the National Average
The above facts don’t even begin to scratch the surface concerning the conditions on the reservation."
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My mother considers herself to be Christian and often said to me when I would pick up an angel off the angel tree at Christmas time that charity begins at home, and I should worry about my nephews and cousins that didn't have anything. It would seem this is on a much larger scale. It is appalling that even though we are one of the "great powers" that there are so many within our borders that are so, for lack of a better term, "bad off". I can't help but question how we can be such a great example to others when we don't even take care of our neighbors within our borders.
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I completely agree that there are many, many, states WITHIN the U.S. that are just as bad off as the underdeveloped countries throughout the world! For some sad reason these places to always seem to fall beneath the cracks without ever getting anyones help!
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A persons true worth should always be measured in what he has to share, not what he has to hoard.
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In support of an International Tribunal on North American Genocide
by David Sugar on Monday, August 16, 2010 at 4:38pm
Healing cannot even begin for the survivors of genocide until truth emerges and is acknowledged. This to me is one of several essential reasons I have chosen to support and if possible to actively participate in Kevin Annett's call for holding an International tribunal on North American genocide.
With the mass graves of perhaps 100,000 indigenous school children of recent origin littered over the North American continent, and many more systematically and sexually abused, and used in human medical experiments, it is for the direct survivors, the surviving victims of these crimes, and families to finally know where their missing children have been buried that is another essential reason for such a tribunal to be organized at this time.
Given the refusal of past and present governments in the United States and Canada to fulfill it's legal obligations, it is only through compulsion of international authorities that it may finally be possible to collect documents of precisely who was killed where, and enable the remains of these lost children to finally be returned to their relatives.
While I am speaking of crimes against humanity and genocide against the indigenous population that have happened only within the last 40 years, and of course including of course the program of mass sterilization of Lakotah women, this gets to the third essential reason for such a convening such tribunal at this time. Along with the survivors who have direct living memory of these events, many of the participants and direct architects of these policies remain free and at large, including a former president of the United States of America (as his crimes predate his presidency, sovereign immunity does not apply). These individuals must finally be brought to justice and held accountable for their crimes, as well as the institutions and governments they have served. Neither does time makes this any less an obligation, as demonstrated by the prosecution of war crimes and crimes against humanity stemming from Nuremberg demonstrate, nor must there be any sanctuary or place such people can live free.
The final reason I offer, perhaps most important reason for holding such a tribunal, is to prevent both continuing policies of genocide and to prevent future crimes against humanity in North America. This reason is the future of the survivors and their descendants. Hence, it would be essential for such a tribunal to consider not only remediation through prosecution of those responsible for these immediate crimes, nor simply questions such as reparations for victims, but also actions necessary in light of continued and institutional practice of genocide and the continued refusal of these governments to meet their binding legal obligations under international law, as well as the entire history of genocide in North America that brought us to this point.
Such remediations may well include calling for a complete program of decolonization and the re-establishment of fully sovereign indigenous nations that was illegally taken in the past, so that the survivors and their decedents may be able to live free and safe in their own nations once more. This or other potential recommendations of such a Tribunal, while perhaps outside of it's direct authority to enforce on it's own, can then be taken up directly by the nations of the world, such as through the United Nations General Assembly.
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Brenda Norrell Thanks David. Is it OK if I post this on the Censored News blog? www.bsnorrell.blogspot.com Best, Brenda
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David Sugar @brenda Absolutely. This one is not a draft, but rather "final", as in ready for such publication.
6 hours ago · LikeUnlike ·
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Sakoieta' Widrick Good stuff. I wonder though how much and how long this will be ignored and we'll be told that we should've gotten over this by now...after all, didn't the both the governments of the U.S. and Canada apologize??? That's supposed to be suitable to us, but if this was done to a non-Native they'd be in court till hell freezes over.
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David Sugar
@sakoieta this struggle is not just about the past, but very much also the present and future for those yet to come. When a bank robber apologizes for past robberies while in the midst of his latest robbery, and then even goes on to commi...t more robberies, what would one make of such an apology?
I find it a deep insult, as well as the whole sick idea that people can be paid some token amount to forget about those killed and crimes past. It is not and never has been about money from what I can see, but rather about dignity, something I think they can never understand.
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Sakoieta' Widrick Exactly. I have had students in my class talk about the money the government spends for Indians to "heal". My comment has been and still is how can we even begin to address the issue when the trauma still continues in the forms of government and religious policy that is still designed to diminish our standing as a people of sovereign nations.
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Chip On Shoulder
Are you suggestions leaders should be held accountable? What a novel concept. Novel to non-native socio-political institutions that is.
As to the sovereign immunity' for acts committed by USA presidents while in office, there can be none in ...such an international tribunal. Some of the most heinous acts and programs are created and perpetuated by such abusive, tyrannical heads of states. While such abusive leaders should be accountable to their own people, in manner similar to that provided by the Haudenosaunee Great Law, it seems wise to have a backup on an international level to sanction dictators and tyrants.
Your call for programs of decolonization are most significant. Too many think of solutions in terms of getting control of the masters institutions or changing them to be 'kinder, gentler' authorities. As the election and performance of Obama proves to those in the USA, hope or belief in change is not enough. Such 'regime change' is not enough when the authoritarian, corrupt institutions remain in place, controlled by the perverted strictures put in place centuries ago. We have to relearn how to think critically and especially to think outside the box they have wrapped the people in.
Too many Indigenous persons speak of the USA as 'our country' and 'our government' and align themselves with partisan politics as if that offers some hope for the future of their People. Just this week I read the words of a sister here on FB expressing pride that she has assimilated, as if distancing herself from her 'primitive, uncivilized' prior existence. If only her eyes could be healed and her ability to think clearly were restored, perhaps she would understand her victimization and affliction with what some term as Stockholm Syndrome.
"Since the relationship between the colonizer and the colonized is so deeply entrenched in the United States and Canada, most of us [Indians] have never learned how to challenge the status quo."
- - For Indigenous Eyes Only - a decolonization handbookSee More
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Barbara Low
The Colonial states of Canada and the U.S.A. are clearly guilty of Genocide. These countries have violated a number of articles of the Geneva convention.
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(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm ...to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
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a) Many documented cases of killing members of the group BECAUSE they are Indigenous. (Pox blankets, missing women in Canada, "Indian Wars", mass kiliings like Wounded Knee, scalp bounties)
b) Many documented cases of causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of Indigenous groups. Deliberately infecting children with communicable diseases in Residential schools. Prohibition of many rights including right to mobility, and vote which lead to social exclusion and ridicule.
c)The Indian Act and the Indian Re-location Act are just two bits of legislation which set out ways and means to inflict conditions which will bring about certain destruction of an identifiable group. Reservations, forced re-locations, etc.
d) Preventing births through forced sterilizations on both sides of the imaginary line.
e) Children were forcibly removed from families and placed in Boarding Schools, Residential Schools, and non-native homes.
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These are just a few of the PROVABLE allegations which should result in a guilty verdict in the International Courts.
The U.S.A. and Canada are not going to magically "step up" and begin to honour the SPIRIT and INTENT of the Treaties, unless they are forced to through serious International pressure.
We have been banging our head against the doors of the White House and Parliament Hill for too long.
Time to take it to the World.See More
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Barbara Low
Oh..and here in Canada, the last Residential School closed in 1996....and over 3000 Native women, have been "disappeared" since 1981 up here.
Trans generational effects of trauma in our communities mingles with the crippling effects of the o...ngoing Genocide - and David is right - Healing can not begin, while the struggle is still being waged in the streets and in our homes.See More
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David Sugar @barbara I would almost think your reading from my note from yesterday ;). It is time perhaps to get that also into order...
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David Sugar @chip you are correct we should not loose sight of what is an essential principle.
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Barbara Low Ah David....at this point, I feel like I have been reciting the above "Case for Genocide" since the dawn of time. I get tired of thinking about it myself. I am certainly done with living it.
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David Sugar @barbara Nobody should ever have had to. All we can try to do is that those who are yet to be should not have to also.
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Sakoieta' Widrick Barbara, that is and has been my point from day one. When I talk with people and they try to get me to accept that because Phil, "Take a Pill" Fontain got money from the government and because Steven Harper issued an apology the issue is closed or should be and they believe it is only Indians who want more money of "taxpayers" hard earned dollars that is keeping things alive. This is nonsense and part of the problem came from our own leaders who are on the payroll for public dollars.
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Now don't get mad at me Walksalone, but I have a question.........I've seen Indian Casinos pop up everywhere. There's 2 close to me where I live. Why can't some of those funds be funneled to help your people? Or is it just a certain tribe that can open casinos, and other tribes can't? I always think when I pass an Indian casino. "Good, the Indians are finally getting a payback".
In Alaska, laws are laid down to protect the Indian Natives that were there before we ever were. They have their own headquarter offices (in Anchorage...Indian Corporation) overseen by the Chief and his council. They disperse the oil money that has been paid to them, for investments, etc. The Alaskan tribes are rich, and getting richer. They now drive snowmobiles instead of dog teams, have planes and airstrips, housing instead of igloos or caves, and the council has built a hospital just for them, so all Alaskan Native Indians have free medical care. If they are in a remote village, and need special medical care, the Air Force or Army go fly them to Anchorage free of charge (there are many military bases in Alaska). They all have a share in the oil/land rights money, and get a certain percentage paid to them every month. Some shun this, and choose to live like they always have.....off the land. You can't force people to upgrade their living conditions unless they want it. The state government has went out to the most remote villages and built beautiful schools, housing, roads, airstrips, etc. For doing that we are cursed for upsetting their culture and ways of life. I understand they want to preserve their heritage, but surely they can partake of the financial windfall that has come their way to give their children a better education and life.
Now......WE introduced alcohol to them (among other things), when we inhabited Alaska. Wrong, wrong, wrong thing to do. Something in their chemical makeup does not tell them when to stop drinking. All the problems of alcoholism, rape, incest, suicide, are rampant in their villages. The government is conducting studies why they have such a high rate of these happenings. If it's their living conditions, there is money and opportunity to change that......but some do not want to become "americanized", and shun our help. Citing, that all we want to do is take away their way of life. They are suspicious of anyone trying to help them for the better.
They want to stay together on their own Rez'z, because they don't want to mingle with the white man, or trust him to help them. There's 2 here where I live, and they sometimes block the road, so even if we wanted to help with a fire or something, we can't get through.
Here's are my pet peeves:
All sorts of jobs are going overseas and leaving the US employment poor. There are no sanctions in place to stop it, never has.
Also, we are the richest country in the world, and still some of our children go to bed hungry......shameful. Amy, we too have charity soup kitchens, and food banks, but they are all church supported or donations. There is no State or Government help. IMO welfare has been abused, and those who really need it don't qualify. No medical care for the poor and elderly who really need it the most because of poverty conditions they are forced to live in.
There's more, but this will do for now.........
There is a debate going on about giving SSI to immigrants that have not paid into it. SSI has been "dipped" into so much by Government, that it's not going to last for those who are working now and paying into it......sad.
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Okay, call me stupid, but who has been killing your people (genocide) the last 40 years. This is not sarcasm, I really don't know :dontknow:
The Jews are still trying to bring those to court that this very thing your are talking about. It's in the millions for them (Halocaust). Even today they are being told that it actually didn't happen. UNBELIEVABLE!!
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The Jews are still trying to bring those to court that this very thing your are talking about. It's in the millions for them (Halocaust). Even today they are being told that it actually didn't happen. UNBELIEVABLE!!
I agree unbelievable. There's pictures, there's books, HELLO!
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Now don't get mad at me Walksalone, but I have a question.........I've seen Indian Casinos pop up everywhere. There's 2 close to me where I live. Why can't some of those funds be funneled to help your people? Or is it just a certain tribe that can open casinos, and other tribes can't? I always think when I pass an Indian casino. "Good, the Indians are finally getting a payback".
I am not mad at all, my position has always been that if more people knew the truth of matters we would enjoy much more support, understanding and acceptance.
I can not speak for every tribe as there are over 500 federally recognized tribes and many many more without recognition. I can only speak on what I know. The casino issue is truly a double edged sword so to speak. Some tribes embrace the concept, others do not. I see good and bad in it depending on how it is utilized. In my Nation, we do well with our casino and many social programs and needs have been fulfilled as well as many public services being able to be offered or upgraded as well as much infra structure being put in place, all of which was mostly enabled due to casino revenue.
Another nation I know of within the state of california has a very profitable casino, however, their way is to divide the proceeds up between all tribal members over the age of 18. Sounds great huh? Not so fast. Every member of that tribe over 18 gets a per-cap check in an amount in excess of 20 thousand dollars, while their Rez falls down around them. Now you tell me, how many 18 year olds do you know who have the maturity to handle personal, unrestricted wealth such as that? You go to one of their pow wows and you see a parking lot full of hummers etc and a crowd of meth'd out Indians. Not good.
Another thing many don't know about the casino issue is the amount of dollars that goes into state and local governments thru taxes. If you are interested I can look up some figures for you.....they are pretty mind boggling.
In Alaska, laws are laid down to protect the Indian Natives that were there before we ever were. They have their own headquarter offices (in Anchorage) overseen by the Chief and his council. They disperse the oil money that has been paid to them, for investments, etc. The Alaskan tribes are rich, and getting richer. They now drive snowmobiles instead of dog teams, have planes and airstrips, housing instead of igloos or caves, and the council has built a hospital just for them, so all Alaskan Native Indians have free medical care. If they are in a remote village, and need special medical care, the Air Force or Army go fly them to Anchorage free of charge (there are many military bases in Alaska). They all have a share in the oil/land rights money, and get a certain percentage paid to them every month. Some shun this, and choose to live like they always have.....off the land. You can't force people to upgrade their living conditions unless they want it. The state government has went out to the most remote villages and built beautiful schools, housing, roads, airstrips, etc. For doing that we are cursed for upsetting their culture and ways of life. I understand they want to preserve their heritage, but surely they can partake of the financial windfall that has come their way to give their children a better education and life.
Again, I can not speak for Alaska tribes, but......
And oh yeah before I forget, I meant to add this to an earlier post I made to you but it slipped my mind. I am very appreciative and actually a bit surprised, that you are informed enough and sensitive enough, to not call the Inuit, Eskimos. I have a lot of respect for that. Thank you.
The federally recognized tribes that I have experiance with were granted recognition under certain conditions only. One of which is how tribal council members are installed. Back in the day, in my Nation atleast, there were a council of Elders all of which were women. These Elder women would nominate a male for this position or that based on their qualifications. You may know that each tribe has several Chiefs. We have a war Chief, a peace Chief a Principal Chief etc etc. The men that were nominated by the Elder Womens Council member would be voted on by the full council. If elected then they were installed into position. If the goofed up these same women have the power to strip them of their position. This is our traditional method and what is ecognized by the majority of "Traditionals" now the government had other ideas. Their demand was that the Tribal Chairman would be chosen in a general election however the canidates must be someone who the fed endorses. Most often the only choices are between on totally assimilated and unconcerned individual or an other.Most traditionals do not recognize these "leaders" and mostly ignore them and some do not participate in the bogus elections. However, these "leaders" are the only ones who Washington DC recognizes. Usually these people are simply puppets for the fed and do the bidding of the Fed, in other words, puppet governments posing as legit leaders of a sovereign country, which according to us, we all are and according to the US ony federally recognized tribes are.
Now......WE introduced alcohol to them (among other things), when we inhabited Alaska. Wrong, wrong, wrong thing to do. Something in their chemical makeup does not tell them when to stop drinking. All the problems of alcoholism, rape, incest, suicide, are rampant in their villages. The government is conducting studies why they have such a high rate of these happenings. If it's their living conditions, there is money and opportunity to change that......but some do not want to become "americanized", and shun our help. Citing, that all we want to do is take away their way of life. They are suspicious of anyone trying to help them for the better.
Actually some tribes had a form of Tequila that was used in some ceremonial traditions. I think alcohol as well as tobacco, which we consider sacred, are like many other things. If they are used appropriately thats one thing such as in ceremony, however where we get into trouble is when we begin using them in a personal recreational manner.
My thoughts on the substance abuse and highly inflated suicide statistics are pretty much due to the same thing......hopelessness and despair and very low self esteem and lack of tribal pride. I could go on and on about my opinion these conditions exist but will refrain for now..
They want to stay together on their own Rez'z, because they don't want to mingle with the white man, or trust him to help them. There's 2 here where I live, and they sometimes block the road, so even if we wanted to help with a fired or something, we can't get through.
Why would that be? I am truly not trying to be a smart *bleep* but I ask this in a very respectful way. Is there even one of the several treaties made between the US and the various Nations that have never been broken and are being honored in their entirety today. Here-n may lie the answer to the trust issue.
Here's are my pet peeves:
All sorts of jobs are going overseas and leaving the US employment poor. There are no sanctions in place to stop it, never has.
Also, we are the richest country in the world, and still some of our children go to bed hungry......shameful. Amy, we too have charity soup kitchens, and food banks, but they are all church supported or donations. There is no State or Government help. IMO welfare has been abused, and those who really need it don't qualify. No medical care for the poor and elderly who really need it the most because of poverty condition they are forced to live in.
There's more, but this will do for now.........
There is a debate going on about giving SSI to immigrants that have not paid into it. SSI has been "dipped" into so much by Government, that it's not going to last for those who are working now and paying into it......sad.
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Okay, call me stupid, but who has been killing your people (genocide) the last 40 years. This is not sarcasm, I really don't know :dontknow:
The Jews are still trying to bring those to court that this very thing your are talking about. It's in the millions for them (Halocaust). Even today they are being told that it actually didn't happen. UNBELIEVABLE!!
The number I believe is estimated at around 6 million Jewish holocaust murdered. Not to trivialize that number in anyway but our numbers were much higher. And yes it happened to the Jewish Peoples and yes it happened to us and yes it continues, albeit much more quietly today. To answer your question as to who I must first say this. Most traditionals, including myself, do not recognize generally the Canadian nor the Mexican borders. To us the whole of what you know as the north american continent is known by our traditional name for it which is Turtle Island so please don't be put off by my answer.
The best source I can direct you to is out of Canada or what we call the First Nations. It encompasses more of our issues in one site then is available elsewhere, therefor, for a base overview I would suggest the site www.hiddenfromhistory.com I can dig up much info on the same issues here in the states however it will necessarily be quite an extensive list but I will be happy to begin that process if interest is expressed.
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Okay, call me stupid, but who has been killing your people (genocide) the last 40 years. This is not sarcasm, I really don't know :dontknow:
The Jews are still trying to bring those to court that this very thing your are talking about. It's in the millions for them (Halocaust). Even today they are being told that it actually didn't happen. UNBELIEVABLE!!
The number I believe is estimated at around 6 million Jewish holocaust murdered. Not to trivialize that number in anyway but our numbers were much higher. And yes it happened to the Jewish Peoples and yes it happened to us and yes it continues, albeit much more quietly today. To answer your question as to who I must first say this. Most traditionals, including myself, do not recognize generally the Canadian nor the Mexican borders. To us the whole of what you know as the north american continent is known by our traditional name for it which is Turtle Island so please don't be put off by my answer.
The best source I can direct you to is out of Canada or what we call the First Nations. It encompasses more of our issues in one site then is available elsewhere, therefor, for a base overview I would suggest the site www.hiddenfromhistory.com I can dig up much info on the same issues here in the states however it will necessarily be quite an extensive list but I will be happy to begin that process if interest is expressed.
Yeah, I heard that the taxes on the casinos was off the chart, and they're trying to raise them again. Money doesn't help quality of life if it's pissed away (pardon my language). Too bad there aren't better laws that a certain percentage of those checks should go into an account for improving living conditions of the Rez. Or put in a trust fund until they are old enough to use it wisely.
Okay, I went to the website, but there wasn't anything there to tell me about the genocide in history or where/why it's happening now. Not that I can't do my own research. Surely there are writings about this somewhere.....hidden or not. You happen to know about it from somewhere. You don't have to go into detail, but if you would point me in a direction, I can do the research. Obviously it's not in your normal history books.
I have Inuit Indian friends in Alaska, I still keep in touch with. We'd go berry picking, Salmon fishing, hunting, ect. together. Had to move from Alaska after 16 years(very sad day), because the cold was making my Asthma life threatening. Since it's cold up there most of the time, moving was mandatory. Some Indians still live pretty much how they did a century ago. They can still hunt and fish the land (subsistence), even if there are laws that the other populace can't. They're trying to put a ban on their whale hunting, but they don't kill that much. I say let them go ahead and get one now and then. It keeps their culture alive.
I don't know if you remember when those 2 whales were stuck in Alaska after a glacier calved and trapped them? Anyway, all kinds of scientists, PHD types, Networks, etc. went up to see if there was a way to free them. They spent thousands upon thousands of dollars trying to free those whales. Me and my friends were just laughing at the fools and how much money they wasted on 2 whales. Well, they finally got them free, and everyone was patting themselves on the back like they were the biggest heros of the hour. My Inuit friends turned to me and said "you wait here, we're gonna go get our boats and get them whales, it's like shooting fish in a barrel". Of course they were joking, and we had a big laugh, BUT.......they could have if they wanted because there was nothing legally to stop them.
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Okay, call me stupid, but who has been killing your people (genocide) the last 40 years. This is not sarcasm, I really don't know :dontknow:
The Jews are still trying to bring those to court that this very thing your are talking about. It's in the millions for them (Halocaust). Even today they are being told that it actually didn't happen. UNBELIEVABLE!!
The number I believe is estimated at around 6 million Jewish holocaust murdered. Not to trivialize that number in anyway but our numbers were much higher. And yes it happened to the Jewish Peoples and yes it happened to us and yes it continues, albeit much more quietly today. To answer your question as to who I must first say this. Most traditionals, including myself, do not recognize generally the Canadian nor the Mexican borders. To us the whole of what you know as the north american continent is known by our traditional name for it which is Turtle Island so please don't be put off by my answer.
The best source I can direct you to is out of Canada or what we call the First Nations. It encompasses more of our issues in one site then is available elsewhere, therefor, for a base overview I would suggest the site www.hiddenfromhistory.com I can dig up much info on the same issues here in the states however it will necessarily be quite an extensive list but I will be happy to begin that process if interest is expressed.
Yeah, I heard that the taxes on the casinos was off the chart, and they're trying to raise them again. Money doesn't help quality of life if it's pissed away (pardon my language). Too bad there aren't better laws that a certain percentage of those checks should go into an account for improving living conditions of the Rez. Or put in a trust fund until they are old enough to use it wisely.
Okay, I went to the website, but there wasn't anything there to tell me about the genocide in history or where/why it's happening now. Not that I can't do my own research. Surely there are writings about this somewhere.....hidden or not. You happen to know about it from somewhere. You don't have to go into detail, but if you would point me in a direction, I can do the research. Obviously it's not in your normal history books.
I have Inuit Indian friends in Alaska, I still keep in touch with. We'd go berry picking, Salmon fishing, hunting, ect. together. Had to move from Alaska after 16 years(very sad day), because the cold was making my Asthma life threatening. Since it's cold up there most of the time, moving was mandatory. Some Indians still live pretty much how they did a century ago. They can still hunt and fish the land (subsistence), even if there are laws that the other populace can't. They're trying to put a ban on their whale hunting, but they don't kill that much. I say let them go ahead and get one now and then. It keeps their culture alive.
I don't know if you remember when those 2 whales were stuck in Alaska after a glacier calved and trapped them? Anyway, all kinds of scientists, PHD types, Networks, etc. went up to see if there was a way to free them. They spent thousands upon thousands of dollars trying to free those whales. Me and my friends were just laughing at the fools and how much money they wasted on 2 whales. Well, they finally got them free, and everyone was patting themselves on the back like they were the biggest heros of the hour. My Inuit friends turned to me and said "you wait here, we're gonna go get our boats and get them whales, it's like shooting fish in a barrel". Of course they were joking, and we had a big laugh, BUT.......they could have if they wanted because there was nothing legally to stop them.
here is one pretty informative article and I will go thru my files and do some more digging tomorrow. http://www.angelfire.com/band/senaaeurope/DRelocation.html also in the post I made above, below David Sugars article in the comments, Barbara Low(my significant other ;D) made some pretty good points on what the UN considers genocidal attempts and paired to them acts carried and some being carried out against the Indigenous of this continent. She does not list sources as this was a conversation amongst fellow activist, who all have common knowledge of these things, however, it is an easy matter to find lots of info on these and other issues using any search engine. But like I say I will also post more info myself tomorrow.
I want to express my gratitude for your interest in these matters.
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I visited the website and it's pretty informative. Where is Part 1 and 3? I can go from here, and pretty much get all the information I need via the web. If you have something that I can't find out looking in cyberspace, I'd be interested if you could post where I might find it (book?) It's disturbing to me I've never heard of this.
May I inject something here. I do understand your apprehensions about Christians, but not everyone who professes to be followers of Christ.....are. For the sake of offending anyone here I won't mention the main movement that went into a lot of countries and wrecked havoc. They amassed hugh armies under the guise of doing the Lord's work to "cleanse" the lands. Anyone who did not convert was counted an enemy of the church and was murdered.
Our roots are completely foreign with this large movement (the "C" church). In fact, today we very much separate from the "form" of standard religion, and have incurred disapproval with most churches branching from this "mother church" (we don't care). We have nothing to connect us to her or her doctrine. Our roots DO NOT stem from her (past or present). We call her the great *bleep* of Babylon. We shy away from anything and everything she is about. I've probably made this clear as mud, but hope you can read between the lines, and pick up the hint.
Our Prophets, Founders, and followers, were tortured and murdered ourselves because we would not convert to her in the beginnings of our faith and the forming of the church of Acts.
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I visited the website and it's pretty informative. Where is Part 1 and 3? I can go from here, and pretty much get all the information I need via the web. If you have something that I can't find out looking in cyberspace, I'd be interested if you could post where I might find it (book?) It's disturbing to me I've never heard of this.
May I inject something here. I do understand your apprehensions about Christians, but not everyone who professes to be followers of Christ.....are. For the sake of offending anyone here I won't mention the main movement that went into a lot of countries and wrecked havoc. They amassed hugh armies under the guise of doing the Lord's work to "cleanse" the lands. Anyone who did not convert was counted an enemy of the church and was murdered.
Our roots are completely foreign with this large movement (the "C" church). In fact, today we very much separate from the "form" of standard religion, and have incurred disapproval with most churches branching from this "mother church" (we don't care). We have nothing to connect us to her or her doctrine. Our roots DO NOT stem from her (past or present). We call her the great *bleep* of Babylon. We shy away from anything and everything she is about. I've probably made this clear as mud, but hope you can read between the lines, and pick up the hint.
Our Prophets, Founders, and followers, were tortured and murdered ourselves because we would not convert to her in the beginnings of our faith and the forming of the church of Acts.
I would suggest Ward Churchhills book titled A Little Thing Called Genocide, you can also find lectures presented by him online. Wynona LaDuke, any thing by Vine Deloria Jr, John Trudell, Russell Means.....ahhh the list goes on and on, but that should keep you busy for tonight anyway ;)
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Autumn TwoBulls August 23 at 12:59pm Reply
"Pine Ridge Statistics
Pine Ridge ReservationHumanitarian Rescue
STATISTICAL DATA
Despite nearly-insurmountable conditions, few resources, and against unbelievable odds, Indigenous people are struggling hard to overcome decades of neglect, discrimination and forced destruction of their traditional cultures to promote a life of self-respect and self-sufficiency.
BRIEF STATISTICS
* 97% of of the population at Pine Ridge Reservation live below federal poverty line.
* The unemployment rate vacillates from 85% to 95% on the Reservation.
* Death due to Heart Disease: Twice the national average.
* The infant mortality rate is the highest on this continent and is about 300% higher than the U.S. national average.
* Elderly die each winter from hypothermia (freezing).
* Recent reports point out that the median income on the Pine Ridge Reservation is approximately $2,600 to $3,500 per year.
* At least 60% of the homes are severely substandard, without water, electricity, adequate insulation, and sewage systems.
* Recent reports state the average life expectancy is 45 years old while others state that it is 48 years old for men and 52 years old for women. With either set of figures, that's the shortest life expectancy for any community in the Western Hemisphere outside Haiti, according to The Wall Street Journal.
INTRODUCTORY
Hidden away, dotted throughout the landscape of America, are the Reservations of the Indigenous People of our land. Mostly unknown or forgotten by the mainstream culture of the dominant U.S. society, the average United States resident knows little or nothing about these people other than what romanticized versions they see in movies and television or else in their nearest Reservation casino. Most assume that whatever poverty exists on a reservation is most certainly comparable to that which they might experience themselves.
And definitely, mainstream Americans are accustomed to being exposed to poverty. It has become nearly invisible due to its overwhelming presence everywhere. We drive through our cities now with a blind eye, numb to the suffering around us. Even more, we watch the televised reports of Third World countries, shake our heads and turn away, rightfully assuming that our government and our charities will help those in need all over the globe.
But the question begs: What about the foreign nations on America's own soil, within this country, a part and yet apart from mainstream society? What about the Native American Nations on America's reservations? Few mainstream Americans know anything about the people that live on these reservations and fewer still know or comprehend the unconscionable conditions present on many of them.
What many do not know is that a staggering number of residents on Native American reservations live in abject conditions rivaling, or even surpassing, that of many Third World countries.
This report chronicles just one Nation, the Oglala Lakota (Sioux) Nation of the Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota. Yet the name and only a few details could easily be changed to describe a host of others; Dineh (Navajo), Ute Mountain Ute, Tohono O'odham, Pima, Yaqui, Ojibwa, Chippewa, the list is long.
But despite nearly-insurmountable conditions, few resources, and against unbelievable odds, Nation after Nation of Indigenous leaders and their people are working hard to counteract decades of oppression and forced destruction of their cultures to bring their citizens back to a life of self-respect and self-sufficiency in today's world.
Below are further in depth statistics of Pine Ridge
IN DEPTH STATISTICS
* The Pine Ridge Oglala Lakota (Sioux) Indian Reservation sits in Bennett, Jackson, and Shannon Counties and is located in the southwest corner of South Dakota, fifty miles east of the Wyoming border.
* The 11,000-square mile (over 2 million acres) Oglala Lakota Pine Ridge Reservation is the second-largest Native American Reservation within the United States. It is roughly the size of the State of Connecticut.
* The Reservation is divided into eight districts: Eagle Nest, Pass Creek, Wakpamni, LaCreek, Pine Ridge, White Clay, Medicine Root, Porcupine, and Wounded Knee.
* The topography of the Pine Ridge Reservation includes badlands, rolling grassland hills, dry land prairie, and areas dotted with pine trees.
* According to the 1998 Bureau of Indian Affairs Census, the Pine Ridge Reservation is home to approximately 40,000 persons, 35% of which are under the age of 16. Approximately half the residents of the Reservation are registered tribal members of the Oglala Lakota Nation.
* The population is steadily rising, despite the severe conditions on the Reservation, as more and more Oglala Lakota return home from far-away cities in order to live within their societal values, be with their families, and assist with the revitalization of their culture and their Nation.
* Recent reports point out that the median income on the Pine Ridge Reservation is approximately $2,600 per year.
* The unemployment rate vacillates from 85% to 95% on the Reservation.
* There is no industry, technology, or commercial infrastructure on the Reservation to provide employment.
* The nearest town of size (which provides some jobs for those few persons able to travel the distance) is Rapid City, South Dakota with approximately 57,000 residents. It is located approximately 120 miles from the Reservation. The nearest large city to Pine Ridge is Denver, Colorado located about 350 miles away.
* Some figures state that the life expectancy on the Reservation is 48 years old for men and 52 for women. Other reports state that the average life expectancy on the Reservation is 45 years old. With either set of figures, that's the shortest life expectancy for a community anywhere in the Western Hemisphere outside Haiti, according to The Wall Street Journal.
* Teenage suicide rate on the Pine Ridge Reservation is 150% higher than the U.S. national average for this age group.
* The infant mortality rate is the highest on this continent and is about 300% higher than the U.S. national average.
* More than half the Reservation's adults battle addiction and disease. Alcoholism, diabetes, heart disease, cancer, and malnutrition are rampant.
* The rate of diabetes on the Reservation is reported to be 800% higher than the U.S. national average.
* Recent reports indicate that almost 50% of the adults on the Reservation over the age of 40 have diabetes. Over 37% of population is diabetic.
* As a result of the high rate of diabetes on the Reservation, diabetic-related blindness, amputations, and kidney failure are common.
* The tuberculosis rate on the Pine Ridge Reservation is approximately 800% higher than the U.S. national average.
* Cervical cancer is 500% higher than the U.S. national average.
* Each winter, Reservation Elders are found dead from hypothermia (freezing).
So you tell me that we are treated fair, and that calling out for help in unappropriated."
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On the Way Down The Erosion of America's Middle Class
By Thomas Schulz
Spiegel [Germany]
08/19/2010
SPIEGEL ONLINE
http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/0,1518,712496,00.html
While America's super-rich congratulate themselves on
donating billions to charity, the rest of the country
is worse off than ever. Long-term unemployment is
rising and millions of Americans are struggling to
survive. The gap between rich and poor is wider than
ever and the middle class is disappearing.
Ventura is a small city on the Pacific coast, about an
hour's drive north of Los Angeles. Luxury homes with a
view of the ocean dot the hillsides, and the beaches
are popular with surfers. Ventura is storybook
California. "It's a well-off place," says Captain
William Finley. "But about 20 percent of the city is
what we call at risk of homelessness." Finley heads the
local branch of the Salvation Army.
Last summer Ventura launched a pilot program, managed
by Finley, that allows people to sleep in their cars
within city limits. This is normally illegal, both in
Ventura and in the rest of the country, where local
officials and residents are worried about seeing
run-down vans full of Mexican migrant workers parked on
residential streets.
But sometime at the beginning of last year, people in
Ventura realized that the cars parked in front of their
driveways at night weren't old wrecks, but well-tended
station wagons and hatchbacks. And the people sleeping
in them weren't fruit pickers or the homeless, but
their former neighbors.
Finley also noticed a change. Suddenly twice as many
people were taking advantage of his social service
organization's free meals program, and some were even
driving up in BMWs -- apparently reluctant to give up
the expensive cars that reminded them of better times.
Finley calls them "the new poor." "That is a different
category of people that I think we're seeing," he says.
"They are people who never in their wildest
imaginations thought they would be homeless." They're
people who had enough money -- a lot of money, in some
cases -- until recently.
"The image of what is a poor person in today's day and
age doesn't fly. When I was growing up a poor person,
and we grew up fairly poor, you drove a 10-year-old car
that probably had some dents in it. You know, there was
one car for the family and you lived out of the food
bank," says Finley. "In the past, you got yourself out
of poverty and were on your way up."
American Way Heads in Opposite Direction
It was the American way, a path taken by millions.
"Today the image is you're getting newer late model
cars that at one point cost somebody 40, 50 grand, and
they're at wits end, now they're living out of the food
banks. And for many of them it takes a lot to swallow
their pride," says Finley.
Today the American way is often headed in the opposite
direction: downward.
For a while, America seemed to have emerged relatively
unscathed from the worst economic crisis in decades --
with renewed vigor and energy -- just as it had done in
the wake of past crises.
The government was announcing new economic growth
figures by as early as last fall, much earlier than
expected. The banks, moribund until recently, were back
to earning billions. Companies nationwide are reporting
strong growth, and the stock market has almost returned
to it pre-crisis levels. Even the number of
billionaires grew by a healthy 17 percent in 2009.
Two weeks ago, Microsoft founder Bill Gates and 40
other billionaires pledged to donate at least half of
their fortunes to philanthropy, either while still
alive or after death. Is America a country so blessed
with affluence that it can afford to give away
billions, just like that?
Growing Resentment
Gates' move could also be interpreted as a PR campaign,
in a country where the super-rich sense that although
they are profiting from the crisis, as was to be
expected, the number of people adversely affected has
grown enormously. They also sense that there is growing
resentment in American society against those at the
top.
For people in the lower income brackets, the recovery
already seems to be falling apart. Experts fear that
the US economy could remain weak for many years to
come. And despite the many government assistance
programs, the small amount of hope they engender has
yet to be felt by the general public. On the contrary,
for many people things are still headed dramatically
downward.
According to a recent opinion poll, 70 percent of
Americans believe that the recession is still in full
swing. And this time it isn't just the poor who are
especially hard-hit, as they usually are during
recessions.
This time the recession is also affecting well-educated
people who had been earning a good living until now.
These people, who see themselves as solidly
middle-class, now feel more threatened than ever before
in the country's history. Four out of 10 Americans who
consider themselves part of this class believe that
they will be unable to maintain their social status.
Unemployment Persists
In a recent cover story titled "So long, middle class,"
the New York Post presented its readers with "25
statistics that prove that the middle class is being
systematically wiped out of existence in America." Last
week, the leading online columnist Arianna Huffington
issued the almost apocalyptic warning that "America is
in danger of becoming a Third World country."
In fact, the United States, in the wake of a real
estate, financial economic and now debt crisis, which
it still hasn't overcome, is threatened by a social Ice
Age more severe than anything the country has seen
since the Great Depression.
The United States is experiencing the problem of
long-term unemployment for the first time since World
War II. The number of the long-term unemployed is
already three times as high as it was during any crisis
in the past, and it is still rising.
More than a year after the official end of the
recession, the overall unemployment rate remains
consistently above 9.5 percent. But this is just the
official figure. When adjusted to include the people
who have already given up looking for work or are
barely surviving on the few hundred dollars they earn
with a part-time job and are using up their savings,
the real unemployment figure jumps to more than 17
percent.
In its current annual report, the US Department of
Agriculture notes that "food insecurity" is on the
rise, and that 50 million Americans couldn't afford to
buy enough food to stay healthy at some point last
year. One in eight American adults and one in four
children now survive on government food stamps. These
are unbelievable numbers for the world's richest
nation.
Even more unsettling is the fact that America, which
has always been characterized by its unshakable belief
in the American Dream, and in the conviction that
anyone, even those at the very bottom, can rise to the
top, is beginning to lose its famous optimism.
According to recent figures, a significant minority of
US citizens now believe that their children will be
worse off than they are.
Many Americans are beginning to realize that for them,
the American Dream has been more of a nightmare of
late. They face a bitter reality of fewer and fewer
jobs, decades of stagnating wages and dramatic
increases in inequality. Only in recent months, as the
economy has grown but jobs have not returned, as
profits have returned but poverty figures have risen by
the week, the country seems to have recognized that it
is struggling with a deep-seated, structural crisis
that has been building for years. As the Washington
Post writes, the financial crisis was merely the final
turning -- for the worse.
Where Did All the Money Go?
The boom in stocks and real estate, the country's wild
borrowing spree and its excessive consumer spending
have long masked the fact that the overwhelming
majority of Americans derived almost no benefit from 30
years of economic growth. In 1978, the average per
capita income for men in the United States was $45,879
(about O35,570). The same figure for 2007, adjusted for
inflation, was $45,113 (O35,051).
Where did all the money go? All the enormous market
gains and corporate earnings, the profits from the boom
in the financial markets and the 110-percent increase
in the gross national product in the last 30 years? It
went to those who had always had more than enough
already.
While 90 percent of Americans have seen only modest
gains in their incomes since 1973, incomes have almost
tripled for people at the upper end of the scale. In
1979, one third of the profits the country produced
went to the richest 1 percent of American society.
Today it's almost 60 percent. In 1950, the average
corporate CEO earned 30 times as much as an ordinary
worker. Today it's 300 times as much. And today 1
percent of Americans own 37 percent of the total
national wealth.
Income inequality in the United States is greater today
than it has been since the 1920s, except that hardly
anyone has minded until now.
Little Chance of the American Dream
In America, the free market is king, and people with
low incomes are seen as having only themselves to
blame. Those who make a lot of money are applauded --
and emulated. The only problem is that Americans have
long overlooked the fact that the American Dream was
becoming a reality for fewer and fewer people.
Statistically, less affluent Americans stand a
4-percent chance of becoming part of the upper middle
class -- a number that is lower than in almost every
other industrialized nation.
So far, politicians have failed to come up with
solutions for the growing social crisis. Washington is
still waiting for jobs that aren't coming. President
Barack Obama and his administration seem to be pinning
their hopes on the notion that Americans will
eventually pull themselves up by their bootstraps --
preferably by doing the same thing they've always done:
spending money. Domestic consumer spending is
responsible for two-thirds of American economic output.
But even though Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke
continues to pump money into the market, and even
though the government deficit has now reached the
dizzying level of $1.4 trillion, such efforts have
remained unsuccessful.
"The lights are going out all over America," Nobel
economics laureate Paul Krugman wrote last week, and
described communities that couldn't even afford to
maintain their streets anymore.
The problem is that many Americans can no longer spend
money on consumer products, because they have no
savings. In some cases, their houses have lost half of
their value. They no longer qualify for low-interest
loans. They are making less money than before or
they're unemployed. This in turn reduces or eliminates
their ability to pay taxes.
Turning Out the Lights
As a result, many state and local governments are faced
with enormous budget deficits. In Hawaii, for example,
schools are closed on some Fridays to save the state
money. A county in Georgia has eliminated all public
bus services. Colorado Springs, a city of 380,000
people, has shut off a third of its streetlights to
save electricity.
There are many discrepancies in America in the wake of
the financial crisis. On the one hand, the Fed is
constantly printing fresh money, and the government
spent $182 billion to bail out a single company, the
insurance giant AIG. On the other hand, the lights are
in fact going out in some areas, because Washington,
citing the need to reduce spending, is unwilling to
provide local governments with financial assistance.
"America is now on the unlit, unpaved road to nowhere,"
economist Krugman warns.
Chanelle Sabedra is already on that road. She and her
husband have been sleeping in their car for almost
three weeks now. "We never saw this coming, never
ever," says Sabedra. She starts to cry. "I'm an adult,
I can take care of myself one way or another, and same
with my husband, but (my kids are) too little to go
through these things." She has three children; they are
nine, five and three years old.
"We had a house further south, in San Bernardino," says
Sabedra. Her husband lost his job building prefab
houses in July 2009. The utility company turned off the
gas. "We were boiling water on the barbeque to bathe
our kids," she says. No longer able to pay the rent,
the Sabedras were evicted from their house in August.
Friends and relatives had few resources to help them.
Now they live in a room at the Salvation Army homeless
shelter in downtown Ventura, which is run by Captain
Finley.
The sudden plunge into homelessness is a reality that's
difficult to understand, given the images of America we
are accustomed to seeing in television series and
films. They always depict homes with well-kept yards
and two-car garages with basketball hoops attached to
them. This America still exists, but it's shrinking.
And often those who are managing to keep the illusion
alive can hardly afford to do so.
Americans have been struggling with a rising cost of
living for the past 20 years. At the beginning of the
decade, families were already paying twice as much for
health insurance and their mortgages than the previous
generation did.
"To cope, millions of families put a second parent into
the workforce," says Harvard Professor Elizabeth
Warren, who President Obama appointed to chair the
congressional panel to oversee the government's bank
bailout program. According to Warren, the average
family has spent all of its income and used up its
savings "just to stay afloat a little while longer."
Spiraling Debt
Because they lacked savings, Americans began borrowing
money to cover all of their other expenses, including
education, healthcare and consumption. American
consumer debt now totals about $13.5 trillion.
Many people threaten to suffocate under the burden of
their debt. Some 61 percent of Americans have no
financial reserves and are living from paycheck to
paycheck. As little as a single hospital bill can spell
potential financial ruin.
Chanelle Sabedra's husband has found another job, this
time as a warehouse worker for a company that makes
aircraft turbines. But he doesn't earn enough to get
the family out of the homeless shelter. "I haven't got
a new job yet," says Sabedra. Her husband's job doesn't
pay enough, and the couple has now joined the growing
ranks of the working poor, for whom even two low-wage
jobs are insufficient to feed their families. "We need
the second income," says Sabedra. "Just the baby alone
is $600 a month for half-day care."
In pre-recession America, she and her husband would
have had two jobs each to make ends meet. They would
have worked at the cash register at Wal-Mart during the
day, flipped burgers at McDonald's in the early evening
and perhaps spent half the night working as a security
guard or cleaning buildings. These are all low-paying
jobs, hardly careers, but the combined income is
usually enough to keep a family afloat. In
pre-recession America, life wasn't luxurious for
Chanelle Sabedra, but it was doable if they were
willing to work hard enough and sacrifice enough of
their lives to stay afloat.
What kind of a job is she looking for now? "Anything
right now. Mostly I'm looking for retail, or just
anything to get me started, but there's just nothing
out there," says Sabedra