I do NOT believe in god

[queenofnines]

#1 I think you purposely forgot to mention there were many atheists at the debate as well.
#3 He bullied him? What is this elementary school? I think you're just making exuses for the atheist.

I will quote directly from your videos -- 7,778 people were there, 632 were non-Christians.  That constitutes as "many" to you compared to the whole?  Also note it says non-Christian, not atheist.  97% of a church full of Christians voted that the Christian side was more compelling?  I'm not surprised. 

Why did you not address #2?  Or the contradiction of The Original Sin?

As for "making excuses", it was quite clear what Dr. Craig's style was.  Knowing that he was the more favored party given the group he was preaching to, he would consistently claim that Mr. Zindler hadn't answered major questions when he HAD.  He took advantage of his spotlight that no one was going to speak up and tell him that he was giving false attacks.  Most of the things Dr. Craig said were just emotional appeals to his like-minded audience.  He wowed uneducated people with his bravado.

[laceybriglia]

I will quote directly from your videos -- 7,778 people were there, 632 were non-Christians.  That constitutes as "many" to you compared to the whole? 
Why did you not address #2?  Or the contradiction of The Original Sin?

632 is many. 
I had nothing to say to #2

They had the option to heed or not to heed. When tempted, they chose to disregard the command given them. It was the act of disobedience that woke them to the knowledge of evil. They chose to listen to the lies of a tempter rather than heed the instruction of their loving Father. Once they disobeyed, they walked right into it. The tree and the fruit were the stage for a time of testing and decision. Once they decided it didn't matter what God told them, they acted in rebellion, as if what God told them did not matter. They allowed their emotions and senses take over rather than sticking to what God initially told them and keeping their desires under control. In their act, they put themselves above God's command and protective rule.

[queenofnines]

They had the option to heed or not to heed. When tempted, they chose to disregard the command given them. It was the act of disobedience that woke them to the knowledge of evil. They chose to listen to the lies of a tempter rather than heed the instruction of their loving Father. Once they disobeyed, they walked right into it. The tree and the fruit were the stage for a time of testing and decision. Once they decided it didn't matter what God told them, they acted in rebellion, as if what God told them did not matter. They allowed their emotions and senses take over rather than sticking to what God initially told them and keeping their desires under control. In their act, they put themselves above God's command and protective rule.

All you are doing here is describing the significance of the event while very clearly neglecting the logical fact that Eve could not have known what was right or wrong before eating the fruit that contained that knowledge.  So either god is an idiot for blaming them for disobeying him before they even knew that disobedience was wrong, or god knew that would happen and did it on purpose as part of his wacko "divine plan", in which case we have HIM to blame for the evils of the world, not Adam and Eve.

[queenofnines]

as people's legs don't typically just decide to one day grow out on their own.

Anecdotal accounts are not "proof" for god.  Had what you described legitimately happened, it would have been all over the news, and atheists would not be able to ask the question, "Why won't god heal amputees?".  Why hide such obvious "proof" for god, right? 

In reality, you cannot trust these stories that originate from emotionally worked up people.  You may not be aware of how you are being fooled, like in the case of Peter Popoff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Popoff), a "faith healer" that appeared to know all of these things about his audience thanks to god, but in reality was receiving messages from his wife who had interviewed them via an earpiece.  He also rounded up perfectly mobile people and pretended to "heal" them from their wheelchairs, much like your legs story.

For anyone who feels that god has done wonderful things "just for them", I'd ask you to consider one of my favorite vids from YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dyPiIcLK90  Please let me know your thoughts on it.

[laceybriglia]

All you are doing here is describing the significance of the event while very clearly neglecting the logical fact that Eve could not have known what was right or wrong before eating the fruit that contained that knowledge.  So either god is an idiot for blaming them for disobeying him before they even knew that disobedience was wrong, or god knew that would happen and did it on purpose as part of his wacko "divine plan", in which case we have HIM to blame for the evils of the world, not Adam and Eve.

First, it was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (not right and wrong). And Adam and Eve were given specific instructions from God not to eat from that tree or they would positively die. Eve went on to say she knew she shouldn't even touch it, and she knew what it meant to die. God hadn't created babies here, they were full grown and they did know right from wrong. This was a test. Did Adam and Eve love and appreciate all that God had done for them? Would they obey Him in this one thing He asked of them? They had every other tree and vegetation to eat from, but the first time it was suggested they might eat of this one tree, they disobeyed, showing total lack of love and appreciation.

[Falconer02]

I think it's so funny that religion encourages people to read their holy texts, because for the few people that actually do sit down and read them cover-to-cover, it becomes abundantly clear what the problems are.  I've yet to hear any Christian explain why it's "okay" that god was a mass-murderer in the OT.  Or why the Bible is filled with such useless and distasteful sh*t...oh wait, it's not completely useless, it's great arsenal against the very god they claim to believe in!

Surprisingly true. And this is exactly what I though of when I recollected my thoughts after reading the OT. I'm always brought back to George Carlins stand up routine whenever I hear someone say things like this--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o  Everyone posting in this thread should watch it. Though there's lots of swearing in it, it's as hilarious as it is blunt. He's just so charismatic telling his story.

Christianity is DEFINITELY a castration of the mind.  I am 75% of the way through the videos Lacey wanted us to watch, and I find myself being like a third party in the debate, pointing out the fallacies of the Christian that the audience wasn't allowed to.  As I yelled at the stupidity of what the Christian is saying, my husband came over and joked, "Shh, don't think!" and put his hand over my mouth.  lol

I'm actually glad to have had my brief stint as a Christian, because you're right, you do learn about the world, and you also have "insider experience" to the mindset then as an atheist, which is an advantage.

Hahaha so I guess I'm not missing out on much then? But let's just remember one thing- we're out of the cage and they really want us back in for very odd reasons. Speaking of which...

The tree and the fruit were the stage for a time of testing and decision. Once they decided it didn't matter what God told them, they acted in rebellion, as if what God told them did not matter. They allowed their emotions and senses take over rather than sticking to what God initially told them and keeping their desires under control. In their act, they put themselves above God's command and protective rule.

I understand that it's a myth with a basic moral but people actually think this happened. I could have written a similar story to tell children so they'd keep out of their parents cookie stashes. But it's conveniently at the front of a massive holy book so you can't question it. It happened. End of story. A dirt man and a rib woman, a talking snake, a perfect world, a mouse-trap fruit tree, a jealous immature child-murdering genocidal god. And that's just in the front of it. Why are we even arguing with Christians or any major religion imploring the belief in crazy stories?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Popoff

Oh wow... James Randi ftw. I remember seeing a documentary of his on the History Channel a year ago and would be a great honor to shake his hand.

[Jennsoich]

I believe in god for somethings, but the other day i just found out that i might have cancer in my bones. This is really scary. Everyone feels like they cant figure out why me. I dont do nothing at all. I have three kids and they need me more now then ever. So im a little scared.

[Falconer02]

I believe in god for somethings, but the other day i just found out that i might have cancer in my bones. This is really scary. Everyone feels like they cant figure out why me. I dont do nothing at all. I have three kids and they need me more now then ever. So im a little scared.

Oh no! You might have cancer though? How in-depth was the analysis? Be brave and keep your spirit up. Just remember...bravery is having fear but the will to keep moving forward. If there's anything we can do (research, personal stories, etc.), let us know.

[laceybriglia]

I understand that it's a myth with a basic moral but people actually think this happened. I could have written a similar story to tell children so they'd keep out of their parents cookie stashes. But it's conveniently at the front of a massive holy book so you can't question it. It happened. End of story. A dirt man and a rib woman, a talking snake, a perfect world, a mouse-trap fruit tree, a jealous immature child-murdering genocidal god. And that's just in the front of it. Why are we even arguing with these people?

Yeah seriously why are you? I've been wondering the same thing... You aren't standing up for what you believe in all you and queen are doing is attempting to tell the world how Christianity makes no sense. As I have stated before... Don't you have something better to do?

[Falconer02]

You aren't standing up for what you believe in all you and queen are doing is attempting to tell the world how Christianity makes no sense.

That's what agnostics and atheists do to stand up for what we believe in. Arguing logic towards delusional stories.

Don't you have something better to do?

Don't you? Heheh. I'm tired. I worked all day. I write these as I take surveys usually. I guess I answered my own questions because certain people can collaborate and I have learned some new information in the process thanks to some people here.

[laceybriglia]

You aren't standing up for what you believe in all you and queen are doing is attempting to tell the world how Christianity makes no sense.

That's what agnostics and atheists do to stand up for what we believe in. Arguing logic towards delusional stories.

Don't you have something better to do?

Don't you? Heheh. I'm tired. I worked all day. I write these as I take surveys usually. I guess I answered my own questions because certain people can collaborate and I have learned some new information in the process thanks to some people here.

Okay whatever maybe one day you will realize they actually aren't delusion stories. They may sound delusional and crazy but God can work miracles that sound impossible.
I also do this while I take surveys and do other GPT sites.

[Falconer02]

They may sound delusional and crazy but God can work miracles that sound impossible.

This is one of the cop-outs we're always referencing to. "The argument for Christianity is inherently infallible, since the basis of the argument allows for the impossible."

[queenofnines]

First, it was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (not right and wrong). And Adam and Eve were given specific instructions from God not to eat from that tree or they would positively die. Eve went on to say she knew she shouldn't even touch it, and she knew what it meant to die. God hadn't created babies here, they were full grown and they did know right from wrong. This was a test. Did Adam and Eve love and appreciate all that God had done for them? Would they obey Him in this one thing He asked of them? They had every other tree and vegetation to eat from, but the first time it was suggested they might eat of this one tree, they disobeyed, showing total lack of love and appreciation.

Good and evil has nothing to do with right and wrong?  What the hell?  They're synonyms!!  I see you are making an excuse here, conveniently navigating away from the contradiction and blowing smoke.

In any event, I ask you: how does eating a piece of fruit have the power to change the neurons in one's brain?  How does eating a piece of fruit magically f*ck up the whole world?  How does eating a piece of fruit have the power to transform one's mortality?  Your answer: it just does.  Reality: it is just like any other mythology story.

Why would god, knowing full well what was going to happen anyway, set up an environment where he knew Adam and Eve would fail?  Why would a loving god throw a tree in there that would kill his children?  Why did god allow the talking snake to be there (never mind how obviously preposterous the notion of a talking snake is)?  God knew what was going to happen, so he set the dominoes in place FOR it to happen.  You can't honestly say that Adam and Eve knew the ramifications of their choice, given you yourself said they did not know what good and evil was yet.  I guess that doesn't matter, though!

[queenofnines]

Don't you have something better to do?

Heh, I know you are only saying this because you feel threatened and attacked.  Had we been on "your side", telling stories of how awesome god is, we would not be accused of this!  Anyway, who are you to judge what constitutes as something being worthwhile?

[queenofnines]

IF I hadn't seen if for myself, I would have been skeptical.

Question: why does an all-powerful god stick to small, random, localized events to "prove" his existence?  God is distributing crumbs by supposedly healing this one person, but he is great at not solving any problem that exists on the whole.

And yes, anyone who hears this story has every right to be skeptical, because: 1) the event cannot be repeated or demonstrated again like things that are actually true can 2) we cannot verify the circumstances you describe 3) we cannot verify your character to check if you are lying in some way (by "some way" I mean either it is a flat-out lie, or it seemed really true to you at the time but it wasn't true)

I don't mean to offend by suggesting #3, it's just #3 has happened plenty of times before.

Did you watch the video?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dyPiIcLK90  It is 2 minutes, 13 seconds.