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Topic: Third Degree  (Read 538 times)

Tresbn00

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Third Degree
« on: May 29, 2020, 01:02:53 pm »
Manslaughter, third degree murder is what the officer, that knelt on George Floyd's neck, has been charged with and is now in custody for. Punishment for manslaughter/third degree murder is less than for murder in the first and/or second degree. This essentially means that the act that lead to the death was voluntary, but the resulting death was not. The requisite intent to prove second degree murder is missing. Third degree murder in Minnesota has a maximum prison sentence of twenty five years.The typical sentence is twenty years. Police found guilty of third degree murder, which is a rare percentage, seem to get between twelve to fifteen years. Odds makers are strong on the officer getting five years and out in three with good behavior.

1imaginarygirl

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2020, 03:01:45 pm »
If he only gets five years and out in three, things are going to get ugly. He was arrested and charged quickly (for a cop), so I hope they can acquire more evidence as he awaits trial. They can always bump it up to 2nd if they have enough to prove intent.

countrygirl12

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2020, 04:46:01 am »
If he only gets five years and out in three, things are going to get ugly. He was arrested and charged quickly (for a cop), so I hope they can acquire more evidence as he awaits trial. They can always bump it up to 2nd if they have enough to prove intent.

No matter what happens things are going to be ugly. They already are. :( I don't think they can bump it up.  Once the initial charge is made that is it.  There was a guy arrested locally and charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  I asked about that.  How can you be charged with 1st and 2nd for the same murder.  And was told that they can't come back later and change the charge.  They charge with both hoping he goes down for one.  HE went to jail for 2nd degree because 1st would not stick because it was not a premeditated thing.  Same here.  The cop did not pre plan to kill the guy.  But no matter what happens it won't be enough.  We have crossed the point of no return.  That woman cop that shot a man in his own apartment because she was too looped to know what floor she was on went to jail.  And if this goes to trial he will go to jail as well. But even if he gets life and no chance to get out it won't be enough. People will still be rioting.

1imaginarygirl

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2020, 08:16:59 am »
If he only gets five years and out in three, things are going to get ugly. He was arrested and charged quickly (for a cop), so I hope they can acquire more evidence as he awaits trial. They can always bump it up to 2nd if they have enough to prove intent.

No matter what happens things are going to be ugly. They already are. :( I don't think they can bump it up.  Once the initial charge is made that is it.  There was a guy arrested locally and charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  I asked about that.  How can you be charged with 1st and 2nd for the same murder.  And was told that they can't come back later and change the charge.  They charge with both hoping he goes down for one.  HE went to jail for 2nd degree because 1st would not stick because it was not a premeditated thing.  Same here.  The cop did not pre plan to kill the guy.  But no matter what happens it won't be enough.  We have crossed the point of no return.  That woman cop that shot a man in his own apartment because she was too looped to know what floor she was on went to jail.  And if this goes to trial he will go to jail as well. But even if he gets life and no chance to get out it won't be enough. People will still be rioting.

They can amend charges before trial. I've heard two different news reporters state that the charges could potentially be bumped up to 2nd degree based on investigation findings, and I believe it was the state attorney general that said the same. I'm not sure if they can amend them after the trial begins. I know the family and protesters are calling for 1st degree, understandable but that would be impossible to prove, in my opinion. It's better to go for a lesser charge with a higher chance of conviction, than a higher charge with the risk of acquittal.

stevensm4

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2020, 09:01:59 am »
I didn't know that. I always knew they can add charges but I didn't know they can increase the severity of a charge.
"Let me ask you something. If the rule you followed brought you to this, of what use was the rule?"

countrygirl12

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2020, 10:05:14 am »
If he only gets five years and out in three, things are going to get ugly. He was arrested and charged quickly (for a cop), so I hope they can acquire more evidence as he awaits trial. They can always bump it up to 2nd if they have enough to prove intent.

No matter what happens things are going to be ugly. They already are. :( I don't think they can bump it up.  Once the initial charge is made that is it.  There was a guy arrested locally and charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  I asked about that.  How can you be charged with 1st and 2nd for the same murder.  And was told that they can't come back later and change the charge.  They charge with both hoping he goes down for one.  HE went to jail for 2nd degree because 1st would not stick because it was not a premeditated thing.  Same here.  The cop did not pre plan to kill the guy.  But no matter what happens it won't be enough.  We have crossed the point of no return.  That woman cop that shot a man in his own apartment because she was too looped to know what floor she was on went to jail.  And if this goes to trial he will go to jail as well. But even if he gets life and no chance to get out it won't be enough. People will still be rioting.

They can amend charges before trial. I've heard two different news reporters state that the charges could potentially be bumped up to 2nd degree based on investigation findings, and I believe it was the state attorney general that said the same. I'm not sure if they can amend them after the trial begins. I know the family and protesters are calling for 1st degree, understandable but that would be impossible to prove, in my opinion. It's better to go for a lesser charge with a higher chance of conviction, than a higher charge with the risk of acquittal.

Maybe so.  Maybe it is just they can't come back and charge with more later.  That is what I am saying.  They can probably get a guilty on 3rd degree and manslaughter.  But 1st degree they will never get a guilty plea. By def it is not first degree.  SO if they charge with 1st degree and he is found not guilty then charges are cleared, he is not guilty, and he is free and can even be a cop again.  They may could get 2nd degree because clearly his actions were too forceful.  Even after he stopped resisting the cop did not stop using force.  Even with 3rd degree he could get 20 plus years. Which goes back to what I said earlier - no matter what it is - to certain people it will never be enough.

countrygirl12

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2020, 10:09:42 am »
I didn't know that. I always knew they can add charges but I didn't know they can increase the severity of a charge.

I did not think they could.  Once formal charges are brought.  IT could be different by state.  That is why the local guy was charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  They wanted a 1st degree charge but did not think it would stick so they charge with 2nd also hoping at least he gets that. But if they could get a more serious charge they wanted that.

tantricia44

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2020, 11:11:37 pm »
The police is suppose to serve & protect.......Not kill someone because they hate the race of the ppl they're trying to arrest.

JaniceSW

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2020, 05:54:42 am »
I didn't know that. I always knew they can add charges but I didn't know they can increase the severity of a charge.

I did not think they could.  Once formal charges are brought.  IT could be different by state.  That is why the local guy was charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  They wanted a 1st degree charge but did not think it would stick so they charge with 2nd also hoping at least he gets that. But if they could get a more serious charge they wanted that.

I believe that if the evidence supports an increased charge in the minds of the prosecution, they can increase the charge.  New evidence is often found and interpreted during the investigatory phase which goes on until the trial begins.  Even then, new evidence can be introduced if relevant.

1imaginarygirl

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2020, 02:52:58 pm »
I already posted this in the RIP George Floyd thread, but the charges have been upgraded to unintentional 2nd degree murder. Also the other three cops involved have been charged with aiding and abetting.

countrygirl12

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2020, 03:01:15 pm »
I didn't know that. I always knew they can add charges but I didn't know they can increase the severity of a charge.

I did not think they could.  Once formal charges are brought.  IT could be different by state.  That is why the local guy was charged with 1st and 2nd degree murder.  They wanted a 1st degree charge but did not think it would stick so they charge with 2nd also hoping at least he gets that. But if they could get a more serious charge they wanted that.

I believe that if the evidence supports an increased charge in the minds of the prosecution, they can increase the charge.  New evidence is often found and interpreted during the investigatory phase which goes on until the trial begins.  Even then, new evidence can be introduced if relevant.

I guess I was thinking after the trial starts. Just going by a trial here locally. The guy killed one woman. But was charged with both 1st and 2nd degree for one act. I don't think they can change the charges after the trial starts. Add charges but not change it. Idk. It could also depend on the state.  Different states have different laws.  Just like different states have different ages at which you are legally an adult. Some are 19 instead of 18. I did not know that until a few years ago.

heypeg

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2020, 03:55:28 pm »
I believe the charges are going to be increased anytime soon.

mrsmere

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2020, 04:32:12 pm »
It's good to see something being done.  Their punishment will not be snuffed out with a knee on the neck until dead. Even if your record reaches around the USA there is no reason to suffocate a person.  Let a judge and jury decide.

countrygirl12

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2020, 09:07:06 am »
It's good to see something being done.  Their punishment will not be snuffed out with a knee on the neck until dead. Even if your record reaches around the USA there is no reason to suffocate a person.  Let a judge and jury decide.

It is not that simple. There are things being released that should not be but are going to be used in the trial.  I am curious if he is found not guilty of murder and even not guilty of man slaughter are you going to accept that.  Because a judge and jury decided? Even if he is found guilty of just manslaughter he is looking at 20 years but I don't think a lot of people will accept that. Something I read this morning was saying if he was found guilty of 2nd degree he would be looking at max of 40 years.  Which basically would be the rest of his life.

oldbuddy

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Re: Third Degree
« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2020, 09:15:00 am »
One factor that is being overlooked is, no matter what the charge if it results in prison, the inmates are not going to make life comfortable for him.

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