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Topic: Archaeology and the Bible  (Read 14327 times)

JediJohnnie

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #105 on: May 03, 2012, 12:10:34 pm »
yup i can't respect you at all johnnie...
you say oh its true theres evidence or stuff along that lines but you won't show it
ARENT CHRISTIANS SUPPOSED TO SHARE WITH NON BELIEVERS? SO IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS OR DOUBTS WOULDNT YOU WANT TO "CURE" THEM SO WE COULD GO TO HEAVEN? oh wait you are too wrapped up in your life for debates right?
maybe you just don't know and if so you should just say that instead of acting like your too good for debate
yah you got a life serving a god whos main agenda is give your life to me so i can take it back haha

Respect is a two way street.It should be given if it's to be earned.

I'm happy to answer any questions about my faith that you might have.The problem with debating (here,anyway) is it becomes a game of "stump the christian" by people like Falconeer who pull "facts" out of thin air and expect you seach the land and sea for something to refute him.Something he wouldn't except as fact if it bit him on the hand.That's why I say it's a time waster.But if you have an honest question,go for it.

« Last Edit: May 03, 2012, 12:38:35 pm by JediJohnnie »

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JediJohnnie

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #106 on: May 03, 2012, 12:15:17 pm »
I'm still wondering what evidence we really have that Columbus came here in 1492.I need to see a photo of him stepping off the Santa Maria,an affidavit by Queen Isabella & King Ferdinand and the serial number off the hull of the Pinta!Unless you can furnish that,I don't believe it!Hearsay!Hearsay,I say!

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falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #107 on: May 03, 2012, 01:38:57 pm »
I'm still wondering what evidence we really have that Columbus came here in 1492.I need to see a photo of him stepping off the Santa Maria,an affidavit by Queen Isabella & King Ferdinand and the serial number off the hull of the Pinta!Unless you can furnish that,I don't believe it!Hearsay!Hearsay,I say!


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falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #108 on: May 03, 2012, 01:51:32 pm »
The problem with debating (here,anyway) is it becomes a game of "stump the christian" by people like Falconeer who pull "facts" out of thin air ...

That's completely false.  What xtian would continue to "... bear false witness against their neighbor"?  The facts and logical reasoning presented by those who challenge the non-factual proclamations which xtians "pull out of thin air", (based upon 'faith' alone with no evidentiary basis), are not merely "a game of stump the christian".  That would be a short and relatively easy "game", were that the case.  No, one of the purposes of challenging the specious claims of religious adherents is to increase general awareness levels, (rather than decrease them through blind faith).

... and expect you seach the land and sea for something to refute him.Something he wouldn't except as fact if it bit him on the hand.That's why I say it's a time waster.

That's overtly hypocritical of you, "jumbledjohnnie" since you remain blinded by 'faith' despite solid evidence and reasoning which disputes, (and generally refutes), what that 'faith' is placed in.  That's what make you a fundie who clings to superstition, rather than reason.
One can lead a horse to water however, if one holds the horse's head under, that horse will drown.

             

Falconer02

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #109 on: May 03, 2012, 02:11:18 pm »
Quote
I'm happy to answer any questions about my faith that you might have.The problem with debating (here,anyway) is it becomes a game of "stump the christian" by people like Falconeer who pull "facts" out of thin air and expect you seach the land and sea for something to refute him.Something he wouldn't except as fact if it bit him on the hand.That's why I say it's a time waster.But if you have an honest question,go for it.

It's enjoyable to research claims as I gain knowledge of things I previously did not know about- such as your whale claim. At first it seems somewhat legit until I furthered my research on the subject, found that there was a lot of misconceptions about whale anatomy and how the story held very little documentation to the apparent claim. That's how you research things. Potentially disproving a claim and finding yourself stumped is part of doing research on a subject. And that is why, since we've already disproved the claims in this thread through basic research, we are awaiting you to refute our claims. If you admit to not wanting to do this, there seriously is no reason for you to be in this thread. This is a thread about archaeology mixing with biblical mythology, not your own take on faith. So, again, stop trying to change the subject.

Quote
I'm still wondering what evidence we really have that Columbus came here in 1492.I need to see a photo of him stepping off the Santa Maria,an affidavit by Queen Isabella & King Ferdinand and the serial number off the hull of the Pinta!Unless you can furnish that,I don't believe it!Hearsay!Hearsay,I say!

Irrational demands ("I want pictures in a time photography didn't exist!"  :dontknow:), unlike mine which are simple rational demands-- I'm not asking for pictures, just references from unbiased sources speaking of evidences of what you claim (mainly to avoid circular reasoning). Speaking of which, I am kindly awaiting you to answer my questions rather than discuss other topics that you, again, have done. If you don't want to, and continue to do cowardly hit-and-run posts in the future, I will definitely be linking this thread afterwards to show the blatant hypocrisy to your religious belief system and how you show the traits of a diehard fan of christianity rather than actually being a decent respectable christian.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2012, 02:13:09 pm by Falconer02 »

JediJohnnie

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #110 on: May 03, 2012, 03:25:31 pm »
Quote
I'm happy to answer any questions about my faith that you might have.The problem with debating (here,anyway) is it becomes a game of "stump the christian" by people like Falconeer who pull "facts" out of thin air and expect you seach the land and sea for something to refute him.Something he wouldn't except as fact if it bit him on the hand.That's why I say it's a time waster.But if you have an honest question,go for it.

It's enjoyable to research claims as I gain knowledge of things I previously did not know about- such as your whale claim. At first it seems somewhat legit until I furthered my research on the subject, found that there was a lot of misconceptions about whale anatomy and how the story held very little documentation to the apparent claim. That's how you research things. Potentially disproving a claim and finding yourself stumped is part of doing research on a subject. And that is why, since we've already disproved the claims in this thread through basic research, we are awaiting you to refute our claims. If you admit to not wanting to do this, there seriously is no reason for you to be in this thread. This is a thread about archaeology mixing with biblical mythology, not your own take on faith. So, again, stop trying to change the subject.

Quote
I'm still wondering what evidence we really have that Columbus came here in 1492.I need to see a photo of him stepping off the Santa Maria,an affidavit by Queen Isabella & King Ferdinand and the serial number off the hull of the Pinta!Unless you can furnish that,I don't believe it!Hearsay!Hearsay,I say!

Irrational demands ("I want pictures in a time photography didn't exist!"  :dontknow:), unlike mine which are simple rational demands-- I'm not asking for pictures, just references from unbiased sources speaking of evidences of what you claim (mainly to avoid circular reasoning). Speaking of which, I am kindly awaiting you to answer my questions rather than discuss other topics that you, again, have done. If you don't want to, and continue to do cowardly hit-and-run posts in the future, I will definitely be linking this thread afterwards to show the blatant hypocrisy to your religious belief system and how you show the traits of a diehard fan of christianity rather than actually being a decent respectable christian.


The point I'm making (that I'm willing to bet didn't go over most people's heads) is that you can pick apart ANY old/ancient text for proof of validity.The Bible should be judged by the same standards.Many take Plato,Homer -even early American history at face value.The Bible,however requires some strange "iron clad" evidence.The burden of proof is on you to disprove,not me to prove.

Again,the evidence in archeology speaks for itself.I have much the same articles as the original poster in books in my basement.Forgive me if I have better uses for my time than to rummage through boxes to scan some pages that will be pooh-poohed 3 minutes after I've posted them.(the books are Time-Life,BTW.I'm sure they'de be considered biased as well. ::))

And again,your resorting to name-calling/calling out is childish at best. ::)

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falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #111 on: May 03, 2012, 03:50:30 pm »
The point I'm making ...

How about responding to the points which "Falconer02" raised before going off on diverting tangents?  If you cannot do so, (and feel compelled to diversions), then you are engaging in disingenious 'debate' tactics.  If you can do so but, choose not to, the same conclusion applies.

(that I'm willing to bet didn't go over most people's heads) is that you can pick apart ANY old/ancient text for proof of validity.The Bible should be judged by the same standards.

No other ancient texts have been introduced into 'evidence' to test for validity thus far, (although the Dead Sea scrolls were mentioned by me only as extant evidence that what is called "the bible" isn't what was originally written and NOT as evidence of the validity of the concepts contained Scrolls themselves).  The various versions of 'the bible' have consistantly failed evidentiary challenges to their 'religious' validity.

Many take Plato,Homer -even early American history at face value.The Bible,however requires some strange "iron clad" evidence.The burden of proof is on you to disprove,not me to prove.

Plato's writing concering philosophy and some religion.  Both can be agreed to or, disputed.  Neither are taken at face value by all.  Once again, you, "jedijohnnie", do not have an accurate concept of logic; the burden of proof falls upon those who make an initial claim, ('positive' assertion), and does Not require a dissenting viewer to "disprove" the initial claimaint's claim.  Not only is that lazy on the part of the initial claimaint but, is a dishonest dodging of the actual burden of proof requirement.  For instance, you'd be unable to "disprove" a claim made regarding invisible pink unicorns however, it cannot be conclude from your failure to do so that IPUs exist. There is absolutely no confidence that you'll acquire the ability to reason any time soon so, one can conclude that you'' continue using illogical 'arguments' to prop up your specious religious beliefs.

Again,the evidence in archeology speaks for itself.

Yep, and so far, none of the non-biased, (secular), archeological evidence supports the tenuous claims by by biased/vested interest/religious 'archeologists'.

I have much ... books in my basement.

Doubtless most, (if not all), of them are from religiously-biased and therefore, dubious sources.

And again,your resorting to name-calling/calling out is childish at best. ::)

Since you are falsely claiming both "name-calling" and "calling out"; the burden of proof falls on you as the claimaint.  Post quoted evidence of the "names" you were called, (and if you can find any, evidence supporting the accuracy of those descriptions can be produced subsequently), and quotes verifying where this you have been 'called out'.  If you fail to or, cannot do so then your claims are specious, (without merit), and the default conclusion drawn is that you've lied.
One can lead a horse to water however, if one holds the horse's head under, that horse will drown.

             

Falconer02

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #112 on: May 03, 2012, 04:06:05 pm »
Quote
The point I'm making (that I'm willing to bet didn't go over most people's heads) is that you can pick apart ANY old/ancient text for proof of validity.The Bible should be judged by the same standards.Many take Plato,Homer -even early American history at face value.The Bible,however requires some strange "iron clad" evidence.The burden of proof is on you to disprove,not me to prove.

The burden on proof is on the original claimant, not the skeptic. I'm stunned that you cannot see the simple logical fallacy here. This is like the 12th time we've called you on being an uneducated debater so far. Again, please answer my question.

Quote
Again,the evidence in archeology speaks for itself.I have much the same articles as the original poster in books in my basement.Forgive me if I have better uses for my time than to rummage through boxes to scan some pages that will be pooh-poohed 3 minutes after I've posted them.(the books are Time-Life,BTW.I'm sure they'de be considered biased as well. )

Translation:
"I got proof, many of which are probably reliable souces and would silence you guys, but I'm too lazy to show you so I'm gonna divert the topic and be spiteful!"
How convenient. So you're not here to debate or discuss the topic, but instead you are here just to be spiteful, claim stuff, and then fold your arms and frown. How positively christian. I think we can conclude that you are uneducated (your answers below are written how I sounded when I was 9) and to compensate for it, you attempt to throw nonsensical insults at the people who are willing to listen or are skeptical of your claims.

Quote
And again,your resorting to name-calling/calling out is childish at best

Explain how any of my 'offensive' comments do not apply to you. Because anyone reading will surely agree that you're being an extremely poor example of a christian right now. Dodging questions, being spiteful, and acting as if you know more than you say. These are traits of a child.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2012, 04:36:48 pm by Falconer02 »

JediJohnnie

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #113 on: May 03, 2012, 04:13:30 pm »

i think your religion is false and i have alot too back it up!
now you go around on here preaching it... so if i am pretty confident i know its false i'm going to point that out... cus if i'm wrong you can correct me or someone else can specifically where i'm wrong and i'll learn... otherwise you can learn... unless you are blind...


That's quite a few questions!I'll try to get to some of them.
heres some questions most of which you probably cant answer

Oh,I can answer them,I'm doubtful everyone will like/agree with my answers.

why isnt christianity the first religion? Judaism would be before Christianity.Christianity resulted from the jews that excepted Jesus as the Messiah


where in bible does it say mentally retarded or insane ppl go to heaven?Where does it say that they don't?The heart of the Lord is mercy.


why would god put the tree of knowledge of good and evil in the garden of eden, how is that not testing and tempting them? There is no wrong in allowing them to be tempted.If you put a knife on the table before me,I can choose not to use it to kill.

 does god urge his believers to live in peace with ppl but he says jesus didnt come for peace but for division, and that peace among men is an adbomination to god? The reality is that, do to free will there will be many who disagree about Christ's Divinity,which leads many to strife.

why should we have to earn gods approval into heaven but he was just given the title of god and didnt earn it?This doesn't really make sense.Godhood is not "earned".

if we have a choice why was he just automatically good? how is that created in his image?Adam,you mean? I don't believe he was any different than us.He was born "innocent" until he sinned.

if the puritans didnt kill the indians then how did america get founded on christianity? its shown those puritans were the ones who brought it over I never said puritans didn't kill indians.It's a sad fact that the Indians were treated pretty uncool through early American history.

its a sin to murder but you can go to war?Murder and killing are two different things.You have the right to defend yourself/country,but not to commit murder.

bible says god puts all government in place, do you agree with that? Yes,but that doesn't mean that that government is "ordained" by God.

bible says submit to your husbands and that divorce is sin... where does it say you can leave your husband if he hits you and not be sinning? I know this is a dicey subject that deserves more than just a sentence or two answer.Suffice for now to say 1 Corinthians 7 talks about how a woman may leave her husband,but remain unmarried.It doesn't say that makes her a sinner.

bible says god hardened pharaohs heart... makes point that god predestines ppl to hell... how would it not? because think if god is all knowing and he say how the world was going to play out knowing who was going to hell but he did it anyway... so if he knows your going to hell how could you change it? its predestined It's not quite that easy.It's more correct to say the Lord allowed Pharohs heart to be hardened.God gives Free Will to everyone.He doesn't cause people to do something,yet he allows things to happen that may shape a person's actions.Again,more could be said,but that should do for now.

if lucifer tempts our hearts who tempted lucifers in heaven?We don't always recieve temptation from Satan.Man's heart is often wicked enough without his help.In the same way,Satan can sin without an external tempter.

if no sin can go into heaven and kids are excused cus they arent old enough then why does bible tells kids its a sin to disobey parents and if they do nd die how could they go to heaven? god would have to cleanse them... therefore why couldnt he do that for every sinner?None of us are without sin.We sin at an early age and keep at it all our lives.Most would agree there is an age of accountability,when God holds you accountable for your sin.

god wants all the cancer and bad things and demons... how could he not? because without those things his chrisitians couldnt be tested... and why else would he make man seperate from himself if he didnt intend to test them? and hes all knowing so he already knew that would happen and agreed to make it anyways This is a fairly broad question.Demons are fallen Angles who chose to rebel.Cancer,AIDS and other diseases are the result of the cursed creation we live in.I for one, don't believe they are created to test mankind,but as a result of a chosen lifestyle.


Whew!

That's all for now!






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quietpal

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #114 on: May 03, 2012, 04:40:42 pm »
Thank you JediJohnnie for your above post and your willingness to answer questions.
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falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #115 on: May 03, 2012, 04:46:21 pm »
i think your religion is false and i have alot too back it up!
now you go around on here preaching it...
why isnt christianity the first religion?

Judaism would be before Christianity.Christianity resulted from the jews ...

There were quite of few extant 'religions' before the advent of the xtian cult, (and yes, it was seen as a new 'cult' at the time). Your answer avoided mention those other religions perhaps because you remain ignorant of the fact that xtianity derived not only from the hebrew religion but, dishonestly incorporated aspects of several pre-existing and contemporary, (with the xtian cult of the time), pagan religions such as Aegyptian, Sumarian, Zoasterism, Odinism and native peoples' beliefs, (to name a few).  That means not only that xtianity is a 'johnnie-come-lately' religion compared to ones which were thousands of years old before the hebrew's popped up but, that xtianity is a plaguaristic religion whose authors demonstrated little originality.

... that excepted Jesus as the Messiah[/b]

Since you keep misusing the word 'accepted' and continue to use "excepted" as a contextual error, I'll go ahead and point out that orthodox jews claim to Not 'accept' "jesus as _the_ messiah" because of an additional claim.  That is, the stated position of the orthodox jewish religion is that "messiah" is a title meaning "the Christos" and that it doesn't necessarily refer only to "jesus".  Regardless, evidence of hebrew plaguarism of the Aegyptian religions they found themselves immersed in at the time is extant.  There is no reciprocal evidence available which would indicate that the Aegyptians, (who already held their religious beliefs for thousands of years before hebrew migrant laborers wandered through to rip-off their culture), plaguarized anyone else's cultural-religious beliefs.
One can lead a horse to water however, if one holds the horse's head under, that horse will drown.

             

falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #116 on: May 03, 2012, 04:47:18 pm »
Thank you JediJohnnie for your above post and your willingness to answer questions.

That post was a load of vague religious nonsense and the fact that you approved of it is revealing in itself.
One can lead a horse to water however, if one holds the horse's head under, that horse will drown.

             

Falconer02

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #117 on: May 03, 2012, 04:51:34 pm »
Quote
Thank you JediJohnnie for your above post and your willingness to answer questions

Now THIS is internet gold right here. Am I the only one that laughed?

falcon9

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #118 on: May 03, 2012, 04:53:21 pm »
Quote
Thank you JediJohnnie for your above post and your willingness to answer questions

 
Now THIS is internet gold right here. Am I the only one that laughed?

I gaffawed and posted the textual version of it, does that count?
One can lead a horse to water however, if one holds the horse's head under, that horse will drown.

             

walksalone11

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Re: Archaeology and the Bible
« Reply #119 on: May 03, 2012, 04:58:24 pm »
Quote
Thank you JediJohnnie for your above post and your willingness to answer questions

 
Now THIS is internet gold right here. Am I the only one that laughed?

I gaffawed and posted the textual version of it, does that count?
I furrowed my eyebrows and said out loud "he did?"

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